NCAA Investigation into Indiana Basketball Program

[Steve19]

Originally Posted by jimotis4heisman

i disagree, they knowingly hired a guy who is a crook. ive hired crooks. i didnt know they were crooks. big difference imo. im not sure what the penalty should be but some how i like the idea of vacated games and maybe a one year tournament ban?

You make a good point, except his former offences were well-known when they hired him. And the offences he committed were exactly the same. Indiana should have been monitoring his phone calls more closely.

And, they should have kept Bobby Knight.

[BUCKYLE]

Originally Posted by jimotis4heisman

i disagree, they knowingly hired a guy who is a crook. ive hired crooks. i didnt know they were crooks. big difference imo. im not sure what the penalty should be but some how i like the idea of vacated games and maybe a one year tournament ban?

Well, when I said "they sold their soul", I was implying they were aware of his past. Otherwise, they wouldn't have been selling their soul.

[LitlBuck]

vacated games and maybe a one year tournament ban?

You have to be kidding me. These penalties for what they have done. The NCAA is looking at lack of institutional control and you call your recommendations sufficient. I don't. They did not win anything under Sampson so "vacated games" wouldn't mean much and as was stated in a prior post they probably are going to go to any tournament this year with the players that they have and might not go any place the following year. Indiana University brought this upon themselves and should be dealt with very harshly IMO

I guess the more I think about this the more it bothers me. "vacate games" is almost ridiculous. Maybe if they had a banner that they want under the Sampson era they should be forced to take it down. See Ohio State! Also, if they do have to limit their scholarships for a couple years that would bother me. They already have given out 7 scholarships for this year and are up to 13 (actually is 14) through next year. The only way to punish this program is to limit the number of scholarships that they should be allowed to give out and that limit should extend more than one year.

The Indiana University Administration knew what they were getting when they hired Sampson but they failed to monitor why he was on NCAA probation. I don't care if he lies to them or not. The Administration did not monitor what he was doing and they should be severely punished for that. A message must be sent out to other schools that this type of behavior will not be tolerated by any member institution and they can show this by giving a severe punishment to a school where a historic program. They should not just save the hammer for the little programs.

[OSUBasketballJunkie]

Sampson still sticking it to IU.......

espn.com

Indiana's legal fees for alleged violations under Sampson still rising

ESPN.com news services
Updated: November 21, 2008, 11:33 AM ET

BLOOMINGTON, Ind. -- Indiana University is still paying for Kelvin Sampson's tenure as its men's basketball coach -- and the price is still going up.
The university -- which spent $750,000 to buy out Sampson, who resigned after he was charged with five major NCAA rules violations -- has spent nearly $500,000 in legal fees to lawyers handling allegations of those violations by Sampson and his staff, according to Indiana media reports.

Continued.................

[buckeyemania11]

NCAA to reveal IU decision at 4 p.m. | IndyStar.com | The Indianapolis Star

Decision via teleconference

The NCAA has scheduled a teleconference with reporters at 4 p.m. today to announce decisions in the infractions case involving Indiana University's men's basketball program.


The chair of the infractions committee for the IU case, Josephine "Jo" Potuto, a law professor at the University of Nebraska, will speak on the call.


IU is charged with five major violations of NCAA rules during the tenure of former head coach Kelvin Sampson. The school has not been guilty of a major violation of NCAA rules since 1960.

[ScriptOhio]

Kelvin Sampson resigned as Indiana coach last February amid a burgeoning scandal over NCAA recruiting violations involving improper telephone calls. Now, the NCAA is taking the step to ensure he can't coach a college program for at least five years.
Sources told ESPN.com on Tuesday that Sampson, now an assistant with the NBA's Milwaukee Bucks, will receive a five-year show-cause penalty -- one of the harshest the NCAA can levy against an individual -- while the Hoosiers program has been spared a postseason ban.
The sources also said Indiana's self-imposed penalties are expected to be upheld. Meanwhile, the Indianapolis Star is reporting that the Hoosiers will receive three years' probation. The NCAA has scheduled a 4 p.m. ET conference call to discuss its findings in the case.
Indiana has been accused of four major NCAA violations that spawned from more than 100 impermissible phone calls to recruits by Sampson and his assistant coaches during his first season in Bloomington. Sampson resigned under pressure, short of completing his second season, after accepting a $750,000 buyout.
Sampson was still on NCAA-imposed probation as Indiana's coach for his involvement in similar offenses committed while the coach at Oklahoma. Colonial Athletic Association commissioner Tom Yeager, the chair of the NCAA infractions committee during Sampson's Oklahoma case, said a five-year show cause would not be out of line for a coach who had recently appeared in front of the committee.
The most serious charge against Sampson was that he provided false information to NCAA enforcement staff members and Indiana compliance officers, something the coach has denied. The investigation began in July 2007, a little more than a year after he was hired away from Oklahoma. Once the president of the National Association of Basketball Coaches at a time when the NABC held an ethics summit in Chicago following a string of high-profile NCAA cases, Sampson was not allowed to send text messages to or call recruits when he first arrived at Indiana..
Sampson was replaced at Indiana by interim coach Dan Dakich, then caught on with the Bucks. His entire staff eventually was dismantled, with assistant Ray McCallum getting the head coaching job at Detroit, Jeff Meyer hired as an assistant at Michigan, and Rob Senderoff joining Kent State's staff.
The fallout also hit Indiana athletic director Rick Greenspan, who is finishing out the calendar year after resigning under pressure. He will be succeeded by Indianapolis attorney Fred Glass.
Meanwhile, the NCAA is expected to punish Senderoff with a three-year show cause penalty. Kent State would have to appear in front of the infractions committee to hear the sanctions leveled against him and then decide to either fight to keep Senderoff on staff or reassign him within its athletic department.
Crean has had to contend with running a program that has just one returning scholarship player. When Indiana lost to Notre Dame by 38 points in the Maui Invitational on Monday, it was the Hoosiers' largest margin of defeat in nearly 11 years.
There are nine scholarship players on Indiana's roster after the program relinquished one scholarship as part of its self-imposed sanctions. Indiana took away an additional two scholarships in a separate decision based on an expected poor Academic Progress Report.
Underclassmen who transferred out or left for the NBA following Sampson's departure -- Eric Gordon (L.A. Clippers), DeAndre Thomas (NAIA Robert Morris), Eli Holman (sitting out at Detroit), Armon Bassett (sitting out at UAB), Jordan Crawford (sitting out at Xavier) and Brandon McGee (sitting out at Auburn) -- can now be found all over the map.
Crawford is appealing to play at Xavier right away without sitting out the required year-in-residence, and a separate NCAA committee would handle this case. But Indiana would have to support Crawford's case and Crean hasn't been open to the idea because he can't get his own transfer, former Georgetown guard Jeremiah Rivers, eligible immediately.
And, with Indiana not facing a postseason ban, Crawford has less of a case. The NCAA has granted immediate eligibility waivers to transfers fleeing schools under NCAA sanctions in cases where a postseason ban extends beyond the player's remaining eligibility. Yet Crawford is only a sophomore, so his scenario does not apply.
Indiana officials appeared in front of the infractions committee in June and, in addition, fought a separate charge of a failure to monitor the basketball program. During the hearings, two former friends, Sampson and IU successor Tom Crean, formerly of Marquette, did not speak.
Indiana, which opened the season with home wins over Northwestern State and IUPUI, lost its opener in the Maui Invitational to Notre Dame on Monday. The Hoosiers play Saint Joseph's in the consolation round Tuesday.
Because the NCAA's membership is made up of schools, penalties imposed are directed toward the schools, not individuals. A show-cause penalty means a future employer needs to demonstrate to the COI that sufficient disciplinary action against the coach has been taken since he or she has found to violate NCAA rules.
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Entire article: ESPN - Sources: NCAA punishes Kelvin Sampson, spares Indiana Hoosiers

[LitlBuck]

If the ESPN source is correct, I do not think that the NCAA has come down hard enough on Indiana. They hired a coach who had previously violated NCAA recruiting rules and then failed to make sure that he did not break them again which he did. I know that IU has self-imposed some penalties upon themselves but I think that the NCAA should handout a tournament ban for possibly 2 years. It's not going to make a difference because Indiana probably will make the tournament within the next two years but at least it would send out a message to other schools that they should be very careful when they hire a coach who has a past history of the NCAA infractions. The restrictions on Sampson are almost laughable because I don't think any school would hire him within the next five years but I also think Senderoff is getting a raw deal because he only did what his "boss" told him to do.

[MaxBuck]

I think the punishment fit the crime, both to the university (having only one returning scholarship player this season) and to the coach.

The NCAA got this one right IMO. I'm ready to move on.

[Folanator]

Originally Posted by LitlBuck

If the ESPN source is correct, I do not think that the NCAA has come down hard enough on Indiana.

If you watched them play the Domers last night, you might not say that. That is the worst big school team I think I have ever seen. They will be feeling the effects of this for years.

Indiana Basketball < Michigan Football

[buckeyemania11]

I know that IU has self-imposed some penalties upon themselves but I think that the NCAA should handout a tournament ban for possibly 2 years

well

Indiana did lose basically their whole recruiting class (and had to throw together one) and had players transfer and leave the program because of the whole deal as well

you would think they would had at least got a 1 year postseason ban, but that wouldnt had really meant anything seeing that they most likely wont be in the postseason this year anyway

[LitlBuck]

Originally Posted by buckeyemania11

well

Indiana did lose basically their whole recruiting class (and had to throw together one) and had players transfer and leave the program because of the whole deal as well

you would think they would had at least got a 1 year postseason ban, but that wouldnt had really meant anything seeing that they most likely wont be in the postseason this year anyway

I know. That is what I said in my message but I think the NCAA should send a message. Indiana self imposed some restrictions and there won't be back to the NCAA for a couple years but I thought the NCAA should send a message. The players that they lost left on their own. They were not forced to leave.

If you watched them play the Domers last night, you might not say that. That is the worst big school team I think I have ever seen. They will be feeling the effects of this for years.

With Crean as their coach, they probably will be back in three seasons. He is a tenacious recruiter and has locked up 7 recruits for next year already.

[Folanator]

Originally Posted by LitlBuck

With Crean as their coach, they probably will be back in three seasons. He is a tenacious recruiter and has locked up 7 recruits for next year already.

About the same length of time as the NCAA would have effected them. Just sayin' it looks like the outcomes are about the same. No reason to give them the SMU treatment. Indiana is one of the Jewels of the NCAA CBB and they do not want to kill the program for too long. JMHO

[LitlBuck]

Originally Posted by Folanator

About the same length of time as the NCAA would have effected them. Just sayin' it looks like the outcomes are about the same. No reason to give them the SMU treatment. Indiana is one of the Jewels of the NCAA CBB and they do not want to kill the program for too long. JMHO

That is the best reason.
I did not say to give them the death penalty. Just to send a message to other schools who are think of hiring a coach with baggage.

[Taosman]

"Sure, we cheat! It's your job to catch us!" Infamous U of M quote.

[GrizzlyBuck]

I also do not think that the penalty, as reported is harsh enough. Even if it is only a token penalty (assuming IU will not make the tourney anyway) I feel the NCAA should send a clear message to IU, and others who follow in their footsteps, if you hire a coach with past transgressions and fail to keep a tight enough leash on him then pay the consequences. I myself would ding them with a three year post-season ban, at least two, there is a chance that Creen, who is a fine coach and recruiter could catch lightning in a bottle next year with the frosh and have a Purdue like year and all of the sudden all is well in Hoosier land. I just think to basically say, you have been punished enough by all your kids up and leaving last year on their own accord, and limiting a scholly or two for a year or two, we don't need to do more, is the wrong message to send.