Rivalries and Conferences (Split from LSU v. OSU Offensive Personnel Thread)

[Best Buckeye]

Originally Posted by BB73

For the sake of accuracy, Oklahoma had 3 BCS title game appearances in 5 seasons (following '00, '03, and '04). Perhaps the last one was forgotten since they didn't show up.

That one was media induced anyway.

[Muck]

Originally Posted by BB73

For the sake of accuracy, Oklahoma had 3 BCS title game appearances in 5 seasons (following '00, '03, and '04). Perhaps the last one was forgotten since they didn't show up.

Yeah but the Big 12 sucks.

[Buckeyeskickbuttocks]

Originally Posted by BB73

For the sake of accuracy, Oklahoma had 3 BCS title game appearances in 5 seasons (following '00, '03, and '04). Perhaps the last one was forgotten since they didn't show up.

Thanks, I thought I was missing one. Hard to argue, make lunch and clean up the house at the same time. Something had to give.

Oddly enough, the OU run would further support my position in as much as OU gets mongo respect despite the fact that the Big XII is garbage. Actually, this is the first year that the Media began to realize it.. specifically with the Big XII North... which, as the football gods would have it, presented Kansas and Missouri. Of course, OU still won it.

I wonder what Ol' Tiger would have to say about the Big XII.

2007 - Oklahoma
2006 - Oklahoma
2005 - Texas
2004 - Oklahoma
2003 - Kansas State
2002 - Oklahoma
2001 - Colorado
2000 - Oklahoma
1999 - Nebraska
1998 - Texas A&M

I've never seen such balance. What is that... 6 teams in 10 years?

Even with SEC who also has 6 (he said 5 or 6, it's 6, LSU, Florida, Georgia, Auburn, Alabama, Tennessee since 1998)

I guess, while I'm at it... we may as well just give up the goods on the whole "SEC Parity" crap and post the ACC, Big Least and Pac 10 while we're at it, and just have a look at how much conference balance is available on Tiger's chosen metric

ACC:
2007 - Virginia Tech
2006 - Wake Forest
2005 - Florida State
2004 - Virginia Tech
2003 - Florida State
2002 - Florida State
2001 - Maryland
2000 - Florida State
1999 - Florida State
1998 - Florida State, Georgia Tech


Apply counting: 5 teams. Balance = one team less than balanced with SEC

Big Least:
2007 - West Virginia, UConn
2006 - Louisville
2005 - West Virginia
2004 - Pittsburgh
2003 - West Virginia, Miami
2002 - Miami
2001 - Miami
2000 - Miami
1999 - Virginia Tech
1998 - Syracuse

Counting reveals: 7 different teams. Balance = More Balanced than SEC


Pac 10
2007 - USC, Arizona State
2006 - USC, California
2005 - USC
2004 - USC
2003 - USC
2002 - USC, Washington State
2001 - Oregon
2000 - Oregon, Oregon State, Washington
1999 - Stanford
1998 - UCLA

Counting reveals: 9 different teams. Balance = More balanced than SEC.

Man... So, after conducting a cursory review, we've learned that on Tiger's metric, every Conference exhibits like or more balance than the SEC with the ACC falling one team short.

It's time to re-examine the remark: "I can't think of another conference that has that much balance." Yes, you can't think of any other such conference because you don't know anything about them, SEC homer.

Hey, look at that... every conference is pretty much the same as every other. Any given season, a conference may be up or down comparatively, but as I've assumed, it turns out over certain sample sizes, every conference is the friggin same. Even the SEC...

Balance... indeed.

[z1311]

Originally Posted by bukIpower

It was cold, snowing/raining, the field was wet, and Beanie was running the ball well? Why would we pass the ball... seriously thats another thing that Boeckman has over Flynn IMO. Flynn had Ideal conditions most of the time, but Boeckman has had a couple games where the conditions weren't great (Penn State/Michigan).

I mean we started off doing both passing/running. Then on two straight plays Boeckman fumbles the ball when no one is near him cuz of the wetness, and then he slips with no one around him as he's dropping back. You add those two plays on the first drive with another fumble (no one near him again), and a Late illadvised INT and you'll understand that it was stupid and moronic to throw the ball that day.

I think the OSU O line may be better than the LSU O Line (we 've had some problems with false starts and penalties).


FYI: There is no weather in the Superdome.


(and since the thread already got hijacked to discuss conference "parity")

Originally Posted by Buckeyeskickbuttocks

Thanks, I thought I was missing one. Hard to argue, make lunch and clean up the house at the same time. Something had to give.

Oddly enough, the OU run would further support my position in as much as OU gets mongo respect despite the fact that the Big XII is garbage. Actually, this is the first year that the Media began to realize it.. specifically with the Big XII North... which, as the football gods would have it, presented Kansas and Missouri. Of course, OU still won it.

I wonder what Ol' Tiger would have to say about the Big XII.

2007 - Oklahoma
2006 - Oklahoma
2005 - Texas
2004 - Oklahoma
2003 - Kansas State
2002 - Oklahoma
2001 - Colorado
2000 - Oklahoma
1999 - Nebraska
1998 - Texas A&M

I've never seen such balance. What is that... 6 teams in 10 years?

Even with SEC who also has 6 (he said 5 or 6, it's 6, LSU, Florida, Georgia, Auburn, Alabama, Tennessee since 1998)

I guess, while I'm at it... we may as well just give up the goods on the whole "SEC Parity" crap and post the ACC, Big Least and Pac 10 while we're at it, and just have a look at how much conference balance is available on Tiger's chosen metric

ACC:
2007 - Virginia Tech
2006 - Wake Forest
2005 - Florida State
2004 - Virginia Tech
2003 - Florida State
2002 - Florida State
2001 - Maryland
2000 - Florida State
1999 - Florida State
1998 - Florida State, Georgia Tech


Apply counting: 5 teams. Balance = one team less than balanced with SEC

Big Least:
2007 - West Virginia, UConn
2006 - Louisville
2005 - West Virginia
2004 - Pittsburgh
2003 - West Virginia, Miami
2002 - Miami
2001 - Miami
2000 - Miami
1999 - Virginia Tech
1998 - Syracuse

Counting reveals: 7 different teams. Balance = More Balanced than SEC


Pac 10
2007 - USC, Arizona State
2006 - USC, California
2005 - USC
2004 - USC
2003 - USC
2002 - USC, Washington State
2001 - Oregon
2000 - Oregon, Oregon State, Washington
1999 - Stanford
1998 - UCLA

Counting reveals: 9 different teams. Balance = More balanced than SEC.

Man... So, after conducting a cursory review, we've learned that on Tiger's metric, every Conference exhibits like or more balance than the SEC with the ACC falling one team short.

It's time to re-examine the remark: "I can't think of another conference that has that much balance." Yes, you can't think of any other such conference because you don't know anything about them, SEC homer.

Hey, look at that... every conference is pretty much the same as every other. Any given season, a conference may be up or down comparatively, but as I've assumed, it turns out over certain sample sizes, every conference is the friggin same. Even the SEC...

Balance... indeed.

I don't agree with your reasoning, if you count teams that tie as conference champions you're artificially inflating the pool. You should probably look at which team wins the tie break and plays in their conference affiliated bowl or etc. Also, if you go back enough years, everyone wins a conference championship, which in itself lends some amount of credence to your argument.

Some conferences also inherently suck in certain years, the ACC the year that Wake Forest won. You can make an argument for parity vs mediocrity.

I think the OPs point was that you don't have something in the SEC where a team represents and "wins" the conference outright 5-6 times in the last 10 years. I can't really think of any back to back sec Championships won by any team in recent memory.

The lack of a conference championship game should not give you "extra" conference champions to claim. I mean seriously do you guys claim Big-10 Co champions with Penn State or Iowa?

[Buckeyeskickbuttocks]

Originally Posted by z1311

I don't agree with your reasoning, if you count teams that tie as conference champions you're artificially inflating the pool. You should probably look at which team wins the tie break and plays in their conference affiliated bowl or etc. Also, if you go back enough years, everyone wins a conference championship, which in itself lends some amount of credence to your argument.

Well, to be clear, it's not "my" reasoning. It's Tiger's. Likewise, HE picked 10 years, not me. But, if we apply your moving goal, we find the same numbers with the following changes:
SEC - 6, Big Ten -7, ACC - 4, Big XII - 6, Big Least - 5, Pac 10 - 5 or 6 (not real sure who wins the 3 team tie break)

Lookie there.. everyone's the same.. yet again.

Some conferences also inherently suck in certain years, the ACC the year that Wake Forest won. You can make an argument for parity vs mediocrity.

I absolutely agree with this. But, I didn't pick the metric, Tiger did. No question in my mind that one man's parity is another man's mediocrity. I've made this very assertion myself with respect to the Big XII (A blog I did a couple years ago). To illustrate, the Big XII North is pretty evenly [censored]ty. By contrast, the Big XII South is pretty top heavy.

I think the OPs point was that you don't have something in the SEC where a team represents and "wins" the conference outright 5-6 times in the last 10 years. I can't really think of any back to back sec Championships won by any team in recent memory.

It was Tennessee 1997-98. Which followed Florida 1993 - 96. Not sure what "recent memory" means, but there's the data.

If Tiger (and I don't know if "OP" is the same as Tiger") had said.. say.. 5 years, well.. then he'd have a point. Of course, I would have argued that it's a small sample size, proving nothing, but would have been evidence of the assertion that "recently" there has been parity. But... alas, I didn't pick his numbers, he did. And, he doesn't know what he's talking about, apparently.

The lack of a conference championship game should not give you "extra" conference champions to claim. I mean seriously do you guys claim Big-10 Co champions with Penn State or Iowa?

A co-Championship is what it is. I don't make the rules. If Ohio State and Iowa go undefeated in the conference, did not play eachother, who am I to say Iowa or Ohio State is or is not the Champion? At least in PSU case, they beat OSU head to head. Iowa wasn't given the opportunity. At that point, OSU won the tie break by a better overall record. Which was an undefeated record compared to a 1 loss record. Both went to BCS bowls.

Anyway, my contention is that every conference is essentially the same. I did not always feel this way, and I am on record in various places arguing quite the contrary. It is, however, at this point completely clear to me that conference superiority arguments are complete [censored]. Any conference can be up. Any one can be down. It's exactly what has happened over time. I will concede the SEC is "up" right now. But, I will not concede that that make it "Better" in some overriding sense. The Big XII is "Down" right now. They won't be forever. The SEC, is my point, is precisely the same as every other [censored]ing conference. If you want to argue you're "up" RIGHT NOW... well... fine. You're up right now. Great. In the 80s you were "down." Who [censored]ing cares?