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Political Conversation and Debate This forum is not a temporary one. It will exist up to, and after the presidential elections. Some people want to talk or even argue politics, other's don't. Let's see if we can apply some reason and understanding to the debate.

 
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Old 08-09-2006, 10:47 AM
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August 22

I'm not posting this in alarm or to make a claim that something will happen. I just find it an interesting story and was interested in everyone's take:

Commentary
BERNARD LEWIS
The Wall Street Journal
August 8, 2006

In Islam, as in Judaism and Christianity, there are certain beliefs concerning the cosmic struggle at the end of time -- Gog and Magog, anti-Christ, Armageddon, and for Shiite Muslims, the long awaited return of the Hidden Imam, ending in the final victory of the forces of good over evil, however these may be defined. Mr. Ahmadinejad and his followers clearly believe that this time is now, and that the terminal struggle has already begun and is indeed well advanced. It may even have a date, indicated by several references by the Iranian president to giving his final answer to the U.S. about nuclear development by Aug. 22. This was at first reported as "by the end of August," but Mr. Ahmadinejad's statement was more precise.

What is the significance of Aug. 22? This year, Aug. 22 corresponds, in the Islamic calendar, to the 27th day of the month of Rajab of the year 1427. This, by tradition, is the night when many Muslims commemorate the night flight of the prophet Muhammad on the winged horse Buraq, first to "the farthest mosque," usually identified with Jerusalem, and then to heaven and
back (c.f., Koran XVII.1). This might well be deemed an appropriate date for the apocalyptic ending of Israel and if necessary of the world. It is far from certain that Mr. Ahmadinejad plans any such cataclysmic events precisely for Aug. 22. But it would be wise to bear the possibility in mind.

A passage from the Ayatollah Khomeini, quoted in an 11th-grade Iranian schoolbook, is revealing. "I am decisively announcing to the whole world that if the world-devourers [i.e., the infidel powers] wish to stand against our religion, we will stand against their whole world and will not cease until the annihilation of all them. Either we all become free, or we will go to the greater freedom which is martyrdom. Either we shake one another's hands in joy at the victory of Islam in the world, or all of us will turn to eternal life and martyrdom. In both cases, victory and success are ours."

In this context, mutual assured destruction, the deterrent that worked so well during the Cold War, would have no meaning. At the end of time, there will be general destruction anyway. What will matter will be the final destination of the dead -- hell for the infidels, and heaven for the believers. For people with this mindset, MAD is not a constraint; it is an inducement.

How then can one confront such an enemy, with such a view of life and eath? Some immediate precautions are obviously possible and necessary. In the long term, it would seem that the best, perhaps the only hope is to appeal to those Muslims, Iranians, Arabs and others who do not share these apocalyptic perceptions and aspirations, and feel as much threatened, indeed even more threatened, than we are. There must be many such, probably even a majority in the lands of Islam. Now is the time for them to save their countries, their societies and their religion from the madness of MAD.

Mr. Lewis, professor emeritus at Princeton, is the author, most recently, of "From Babel to Dragomans: Interpreting the Middle East" (Oxford University Press, 2004).
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Old 08-09-2006, 11:37 AM
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Yea, but my wife turns 44 on August 22, 2006- and that scares me more.
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Old 08-09-2006, 11:41 AM
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Heard Glenn Beck discussing this very thing.

Recently, Iranian Madman President Mr. Ahmadinejad commented that Iran's answer to the US concerning their nuclear program would come on August 22nd, as mentioned in the article.

Whack Job.
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Old 08-09-2006, 11:54 AM
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Quote:
In the long term, it would seem that the best, perhaps the only hope is to appeal to those Muslims, Iranians, Arabs and others who do not share these apocalyptic perceptions and aspirations, and feel as much threatened, indeed even more threatened, than we are. There must be many such, probably even a majority in the lands of Islam. Now is the time for them to save their countries, their societies and their religion from the madness of MAD.
I have read countless articles quoting peace loving Muslims proclaiming that the violence wrought by these extremists is not based upon "true Islam," but is instead a bastardization of it. Consistent with the above quote, this may be true. However, the time has long come for Muslims to take back their religion from these extremists. Yet in all the Muslim countries of the world, there doesn't seem to be much effort on their part to rid the world of those who kill in the name of their religion. We can fight the war on terror from now until Armageddon, but I am not optimistic much will change until the peace loving Muslims take the lead in the battle.
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Old 08-09-2006, 04:10 PM
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Wow. Just wow. It amazes me that people can't get along because of religious views. What an ignorant set of views.
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Old 08-09-2006, 06:05 PM
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Wow. Just wow. It amazes me that people can't get along because of religious views. What an ignorant set of views.
Other ignorant fundamentalist religious views can be read on this very forum! (And no, I'm not talking about Creationism.)

I am buying airline tickets for departure after August 22, but am paying by credit card just to hedge my bets.
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Old 08-09-2006, 06:13 PM
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Time to hit up the loan sharks.
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Old 08-09-2006, 07:11 PM
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What if Iran launches some half-ass ICBM rigged with a half-ass warhead? Something tells me we'd have a wasteland of a Middle eastern country full of innocent 'martyrs'. Great plan, Mahmoud.
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