Pope vs Islam

[DEBuckeye]

Warning- gross generalizations below...

I am getting so tired of these Islamic militant idiots going off on anything they see as an "attack" on their death-mission. These people are unreasonable, irrational, hypocritical, over-acting idiots. Anything that doesn't fit into their view of religion (something along the lines of militant Islamic global rule) is instantly labeled an attack, and held up high for violent revenge.

They accuse the West of pushing its ideals on the globe and trying to take over, and yet that's exactly what they're doing. They will never come around to a reasonable position, and they're not going to stop what they're doing. Bin laden is Hitler- he just doesn't have as many tanks...

Its going to come down to a big-ass well placed bomb (or three) somewhere in the Middle East. They're like cockroaches- they won't completely disappear unless you kill them.

Militants vow war, Vatican tries to calm Pope row By Stephen Brown and Philip Pullella
39 minutes ago

VATICAN CITY (Reuters) - Al Qaeda militants in Iraq vowed war on "worshippers of the cross" and protesters burned a papal effigy on Monday over Pope Benedict's comments on Islam, while Western churchmen and statesmen tried to calm passions.

Iran's Supreme Leader Ayatollah Ali Khamenei joined a chorus of Muslim criticism of the head of the world's 1.1 billion Roman Catholics, calling the Pope's remarks "the latest chain of the crusade against Islam started by America's (George W.) Bush."

The Pontiff said on Sunday he was deeply sorry Muslims had been offended by his use of a medieval quotation on Islam and holy war. But he stopped short of retracting a speech seen as portraying Islam as a religion tainted by violence.

While some Muslims were mollified by his explanation for the speech made in Germany last Tuesday, others remained furious.

"We tell the worshipper of the cross (the Pope) that you and the West will be defeated, as is the case in Iraq, Afghanistan, Chechnya," said a Web statement by the Mujahideen Shura Council, an umbrella group led by Iraq's branch of al Qaeda.

"We shall break the cross and spill the wine ... God will (help) Muslims to conquer Rome ... (May) God enable us to slit their throats, and make their money and descendants the bounty of the mujahideen," said the statement, posted on Sunday on an Internet site often used by al Qaeda and other militant groups.

In Iraq's southern city of Basra, up to 150 demonstrators chanted slogans and burned a white effigy of the Pope.

"No to aggression!," "We gagged the Pope!," they chanted in front of the governor's office in the Shi'ite city.

With some clerics calling it the start of a new Christian crusade against Islam, the Vatican has instructed its envoys in Muslim countries to explain Pope Benedict's words on Islam.

The Pope had referred to criticism of the Prophet Mohammad by 14th century Byzantine Emperor Manuel II Palaeologus, who said everything the Prophet brought was evil "such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached."

But he said on Sunday this was not his view and he favored frank dialogue with Islam. His new Secretary of State, Cardinal Tarcisio Bertone, said Holy See nuncios (ambassadors) in Muslim countries would visit government and religious leaders.

TAKEN OUT OF CONTEXT

The European Commission called for Pope Benedict's remarks not be "deliberately taken out of context" and for freedom of speech to be respected. French President Jacques Chirac refused to criticize him, but called for a more diplomatic language.

"It is not my role or my intention to comment on the Pope's statements. I simply want to say, on a general level ... that we must avoid anything that excites tensions between peoples or between religions," Chirac said on Europe 1 radio.

"We must avoid making any link between Islam, which is a great, respected and respectable religion, and radical Islamism, which is a totally different activity and one of a political nature," Chirac added.

The head of the world's Anglican church, Archbishop of Canterbury Rowan Williams, defended Benedict.

"The Pope has already issued an apology and I think his views on this need to be judged against his entire record, where he has spoken very positively about dialogue," said Williams, the spiritual leader of 77 million Anglicans worldwide.

Williams told the BBC that all faiths could be distorted, and the Pope was simply giving an example of that.

"There are elements in Islam that can be used to justify violence, just as there are in Christianity and Judaism."

Questions had been raised on whether a papal visit to Turkey in November could go ahead, but Ankara, while calling his remarks "ugly," said there were no plans to call it off.

In Somalia, an Italian nun was killed on Sunday in an attack one Islamist source said could be linked to the dispute. The Vatican said it hoped the killing was "an isolated event."

A senior Chinese Muslim expressed anger over the Pope's comments, Xinhua news agency said. This was in contrast to Chinese reticence over last year's publication of cartoons of the Prophet Mohammad in a Danish paper that sparked violent Muslim protests elsewhere in the world.

Chen Guangyuan, president of the Islamic Association of China, was quoted as saying: "Benedict insulted both Islam and the Prophet Mohammad. This has gravely hurt the feelings of the Muslims across the world, including those from China."

About 100 Indonesian Muslims protested peacefully over the Pope's remarks outside the Vatican embassy in Jakarta.

[url=http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20060918/ts_nm/pope_islam_dc_23[/URL]

[JCOSU86]

It's called "polemic we-are-completely-right-you-are-completely-wrong" politics. Too much of that is happening in this country too.

[MaxBuck]

No question that there are peaceful Muslims who are appalled by the whole mess, and who suffer as a consequence. But when you have a prominent Islamic group that issues a statement "May God enable us to slit their throats," it's hard not to be upset.

Responsible Muslim leaders have a responsibility to preach restraint, peace and calm to their followers -- and they have failed consistently to do so.

[buckeyegrad]

The crazy thing about the entire situation is that the vast majority of the Pope's talk was against the materialism of the West and the problem of modern society's separation of science/rationalism and religious/spirituality into two distinct spheres with the first holding precendence over the other. The 14th century quote against Islam that had caused this whole mess had nothing to do with his main topic, but was only used to demonstrate a principle he was making against all religions and ideologies that use violence.

[Buckeyes85]

Responsible Muslim leaders

Is there such a thing, at least on a national or global basis?

[FCollinsBuckeye]

Originally Posted by Buckeyes85

Is there such a thing, at least on a national or global basis?

I had the pleasure of attending a ceremony where Queen Noor of Jordan gave a speech yesterday and I can assure you, she is not only eloquent and 'responsible', but incredibly rational. Hopefully King Abdullah of Jordan can follow in his late father's footsteps.

I also had the pleasure of witnessing His Holiness the Dalai Lama giving a speech/lesson at the some ceremony. The Buddhists have much to teach us all.

[Brewtus]

I find it amusing that so many Muslims follow what the Pope says more closely than many Catholics do. I guess Catholics are just used to ignoring the Pope when they disagree with what he says (i.e. ban on birth control, divorce, abortion, etc.).