Vice President Joe Biden (official)

[kinch]

Originally Posted by muffler dragon

I've gotta admit that the Biden selection makes it very hard for me to think about voting for this ticket. Personally, I think Obama did himself a disservice by picking this cat.

Please explain.

. Really though, your opinions always seems based on reasonable intellectual grounds, so we would all be better off if you described why you don't like Biden. . .

[CookyPuss]

Originally Posted by kinch

Please explain.

. Really though, your opinions always seems based on reasonable intellectual grounds, so we would all be better off if you described why you don't like Biden. . .

He's a closet Hillary supporter.

[CookyPuss]

Biden legislative accomplishments (descriptions here), I highlighted a few of the better know measures he wrote or contributed to:

Equal Credit Opportunity Act Amendments (P.L. 94-239).
Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (P.L. 95-511).
Classified Information Criminal Trial Procedures Act (P.L. 96-456).
United States Commission on Civil Rights Act of 1983 (P.L. 98-183).
Criminal Forfeiture Amendment Act (P.L. 98-473).
Global Climate Protection Act 1986 (P.L. 100-204).
The Drug Czar- first in Congress to propose a cabinet level office
Debt-for-Nature Swaps (P.L. 105-214).
Campus Sexual Assault Victims' Bill of Rights Act (P.L.102-325).
Stopping Genocide in Bosnia and Kosovo (P.L. 102-391). (S. Prt. 103-33). (S. Con. Res. 21).
Violent Crime Control and Law Enforcement Act of 1994 (P.L. 103-322).
The Community Oriented Policing Services Program (COPS) (P.L. 103-322).
Violence Against Women Act (P.L.103-322).
Radio Free Asia (P.L. 103-236).
Chemical Weapons Convention (S. Res. 75).
UN Reform (P.L. 106-113).
White Clay Creek Wild and Scenic Rivers System Act (P.L. 106-266).
Kids 2000 Act (P.L. 106-313).
Public Diplomacy / International Broadcasting (P.L. 103-236, P.L. 105-277).
Public Safety Officers? Benefits Improvement Act (P.L. 107-56).
White Collar Crime Penalty Enhancement Act of 2002 (P.L. 107-204).
Illicit Drug Anti-Proliferation Act of 2003 (P.L.108-21).
Anabolic Steroid Control Act of 2004 (P.L.108-358).
Children's Advocacy Center's Reauthorization (P.L.108-21).
NATO Enlargement
Stopping Genocide in Darfur (P.L. 109-234).
Adam Walsh Child Protection and Safety Act of 2006 (P.L.109-248).
Rail Security Act (P.L. 110-53).
Middle East Foundation (P.L. 110-53).
Mine Resistant Ambush Protected Vehicles (P.L. 110-28, P.L. 110-92, P.L. 110-116).

[BUCKYLE]

Originally Posted by MuckFich06

Biden legislative accomplishments (descriptions here), I highlighted a few of the better know measures he wrote or contributed to:

The Community Oriented Policing Services Program (COPS) (P.L. 103-322).

I believe credit for that one goes to Police Academy 4: Citizens on Patrol.

[TRON]

Originally Posted by BUCKYLE

I believe credit for that one goes to Police Academy 4: Citizens on Patrol.

You are just upset that Bill can't run for president again.

[Buckeye513]

Originally Posted by MuckFich06

Criminal Forfeiture Amendment Act (P.L. 98-473).
The Drug Czar- first in Congress to propose a cabinet level office
Illicit Drug Anti-Proliferation Act of 2003 (P.L.108-21).

War on Drugs.

Voted in favor of the Defense of Marriage Act, big anti-drug guy, and continues to stand by his Patriot Act vote. I don't know alot about him, but from the little research I've done since yesterday, can't say I'm reassured.

[MaxBuck]

Poor, poor choice.

Obama is clearly the best point guard in the race, but who is going to take it to the rack? Who will be the Windex man cleaning the glass?

Perfect opportunity to pick Charles Barkley, and Obama misses big time. My respect for him is diminished.

[muffler dragon]

Originally Posted by kinch

Please explain.

. Really though, your opinions always seems based on reasonable intellectual grounds, so we would all be better off if you described why you don't like Biden. . .

It would probably be better if I stated something that had to do with his policies, but ultimately, it's his persona and tongue. I find him to be irreverent, disrespectful, and conceited. Obama's charge has been that he is a man for change when I see Biden as being the poster child for the Washington political machine. Granted, I don't know who would have accepted or not accepted the position from Obama, but there are, imo, other candidates who would have fit the bill just as well politically without the inflammatory nature.

Originally Posted by MuckFich06

He's a closet Hillary supporter.

Not in the slightest. She's a byword in my mind.

[kinch]

Originally Posted by muffler dragon

It would probably be better if I stated something that had to do with his policies, but ultimately, it's his persona and tongue. I find him to be irreverent, disrespectful, and conceited. Obama's charge has been that he is a man for change when I see Biden as being the poster child for the Washington political machine. Granted, I don't know who would have accepted or not accepted the position from Obama, but there are, imo, other candidates who would have fit the bill just as well politically without the inflammatory nature.

Fair enough.

Strangely, I like him because he is most definitely irreverent, disrespectful, and conceited. . . and real. I see him as just like all other politicians, but not hiding it.

At the same time, I need to look into his views. I have serious problems with some of Obama's takes (protectionism, for instance) and will use, to some extent, Biden's views as an interpretation of what Obama values.

[muffler dragon]

Originally Posted by kinch

Fair enough.

Strangely, I like him because he is most definitely irreverent, disrespectful, and conceited. . . and real. I see him as just like all other politicians, but not hiding it.

Quite interesting how we can agree on the characteristics but interpret them differently.

Originally Posted by kinch

At the same time, I need to look into his views. I have serious problems with some of Obama's takes (protectionism, for instance) and will use, to some extent, Biden's views as an interpretation of what Obama values.

Got'cha. And I think that's wise. It will be intriguing to see how this all plays itself out.

[CookyPuss]

Originally Posted by kinch

Fair enough.

Strangely, I like him because he is most definitely irreverent, disrespectful, and conceited. . . and real. I see him as just like all other politicians, but not hiding it.

I'm with kinch here. I don't like a number of Biden's past votes -especially the bankruptcy bill... but I love his persona. He is funny as hell and pretty much a straight shooter.

He had one of my favorite moments during the primary season:

Ben Smith's Blog: Biden: 'Bull[censored]' - Politico.com

Joe Biden uses a barnyard epithet for Bush's apparent shot at Obama this morning -- a Neville Chamberlain comparison the White House initially reportedly said was aimed at the candidate, and then tried to reel in.
In any case, Bush is not the one McCain wants carrying his message. Just the fact that it comes out of Bush's mouth makes it, for political purposes, toxic, which is why Democrats are jumping all over it today.
Classic Biden:

"This is bull[censored]. This is malarkey. This is outrageous. Outrageous for the president of the United States to go to a foreign country, sit in the Knesset ... and make this kind of ridiculous statement,? Biden said angrily in a brief interview just off the Senate floor.

[BrutuStrength]

Originally Posted by MuckFich06

I'm with kinch here. I don't like a number of Biden's past votes -especially the bankruptcy bill... but I love his persona.

I wouldn't let the bankruptcy vote bother you. You gotta remember that Delaware has long been the credit card capital of the world. One such credit card bank, MBNA (now part of Bank of America), surpassed DuPont as the state's largest private employer (2nd only to the local gov't). It was in his, and his state's, best interest to pass those types of bills (as an aside, I'm pretty sure his son is/was a corporate attorney for MBNA/BoA).

And as someone who worked in credit card collections (even at the aforementioned MBNA) and even managed the collection practices/handling of bankrupt accounts for another major credit card company, I can personally tell you that for all of the millions of dollars lost to legitimate bankruptcy claims that have been filed, there have also been millions more lost to customers that intentionally maxed out all such accounts, let them go delinquent, and then filed bankruptcy because they never intended to repay the debt. They just wanted to take advantage of the system for free [censored]. Such bills were passed to help close loopholes to prevent such blatant abuse from continuing.

['BusNative]

Originally Posted by BrutuStrength

I wouldn't let the bankruptcy vote bother you. You gotta remember that Delaware has long been the credit card capital of the world...

Finally something we (almost) agree on, B'Strength... I agree that, as a representative of the state of Delaware, Biden COULD NOT vote against the bankruptcy bill. He would have failed his constituency.

The bill is a big ol' pile of [censored]... that's for another thread though.

[Gatorubet]

Originally Posted by BrutuStrength

I wouldn't let the bankruptcy vote bother you. You gotta remember that Delaware has long been the credit card capital of the world. One such credit card bank, MBNA (now part of Bank of America), surpassed DuPont as the state's largest private employer (2nd only to the local gov't). It was in his, and his state's, best interest to pass those types of bills (as an aside, I'm pretty sure his son is/was a corporate attorney for MBNA/BoA).

And as someone who worked in credit card collections (even at the aforementioned MBNA) and even managed the collection practices/handling of bankrupt accounts for another major credit card company, I can personally tell you that for all of the millions of dollars lost to legitimate bankruptcy claims that have been filed, there have also been millions more lost to customers that intentionally maxed out all such accounts, let them go delinquent, and then filed bankruptcy because they never intended to repay the debt. They just wanted to take advantage of the system for free [censored]. Such bills were passed to help close loopholes to prevent such blatant abuse from continuing.

And as an attorney who has practiced in bankruptcy, I can personally tell you that the number of fraudulent "run up the bill" and then go bankrupt cases I have seen are minimal, with the exception of the many people I see who out of necessity have maxed out their credit cards to pay for medical bills due to a lack of medical insurance. But I have also seen and been amazed by the number of clearly unqualified people who have been given credit cards at a low enticement rate, only to be switched to a high almost usurious rate and high late and over the limit fees upon one missed or late payment...

The Bankruptcy amendments of October of 2005 were drafted and designed by the banking industry to protect their cash cow in high interest credit card income, and to make it harder to wipe it out in a Chapter 7. What Brutus calls "close(ing) loopholes" is what bankruptcy practitioners and consumer advocates call a capitulation of the intent of the Bankruptcy act to satisfy the predatory lending practices of big banking.

So at least you have both sides. I expect that there are merits to both of our positions.

[BrutuStrength]

Originally Posted by Gatorubet

So at least you have both sides. I expect that there are merits to both of our positions.

I certainly didn't mean to imply mine was the only viewpoint, just that would have been the viewpoint of many of his constituents. Since I've been out of banking for 8-9 years now, I'm not even that familiar with the bill.

I personally found working in collections to be quite interesting (quit reading here if you don't want to know about a few of my experiences). Every call led me to another story. I remember feeling sorry for the farmer that was trying not to lose his farm, the small business owner that used his card to pay for business expenses during a down time, as well as the people who suddenly found themselves overwhelmed with unexpected medical bills.

I also remember several unique calls, like talking to a cardholder's adult son, and while asking him about when I could speak to his parents since they always seemed to be traveling when he called, he broke down and confessed that his parents were recently deceased and that he had used their card(s) to buy collectibles, and now he couldn't repay the bills. He worked for a gov't agency and was sure to lose his job if they found out. I had to document his account and forward it to another department.

I remember being amazed by a lady in her mid-to-late 20's who's account was new, maxxed out, and had few-to-none payments made on it. I asked her about making a payment, and she said that she wasn't going to be making anymore payments. When prompted further, she explained how they had received a bunch of credit cards, maxxed them out, and were going to file bankruptcy... just like they had done before. I also had to document this account and forward it to another department.

The job did have it's share of entertainment value. One cardholder's account was routinely delinquent. He was an older gentleman and was not all that rough to talk to. His account was documented in such a way that it suggested for future collectors to ask him about his pineapple (or watermelon) story. He would then take 2-3 minutes to go through his profanity laced story that always culminated with him shoving a pineapple up the respective collcetor's ass. In between laughs, following his story, we would thank him for his time and he would wish us a nice day.

The worst part of each day was making the first call. After that it really wasn't that bad. It really became quite a bit of a game, especially as I worked through later stages of delinquency. The biggest part of the game was locating the cardholders and then getting them on the phone. If you could get them on the phone, you'd have a chance to get a payment from them, and possibly help them get into touch with a credit counselor.

Cardholders of very delinquent accounts, that were parents, would often have children (as young as 4 years old) answer the phone and tell us that noone else was home/available. Many times I could hear them whispering to their kids, instructing them what to say and ask, and the kids whispering to them about what I had said. I could usually get the parents to speak with me on the phone when that was the case. Okay, so it was more like they were yelling at me, and usually right after I informed the child that I was concerned for their safety since they were left alone, and that I was going to call their local police department and ask them to check on the child since there was no adult supervision. And that was OK, because once I got them to stop yelling at me, I could usually talk with them about their situation and update their account(s).

Any ways, those are some of the more entertaining stories from my days as a collector for a credit card company.