Presidential Debate #3: 9 PM ET, 10/15/08

[generaladm]

Originally Posted by jimotis4heisman

how many employees do those "small businesses" have?
how many do the 250k have?

I wish I had an answer for you, jo. I'm not sure if there is a clear cut dividing line between big and small businesses, at least as it pertains to the issues of the debate.

[billmac91]

CNN pundits thought this was McCain's best night, and Obama's worst for the most part. And CNN has called every debate for Obama.

[CookyPuss]

Meet Joe the Plumber:

OBAMA FIRES A 'ROBIN HOOD' WARNING SHOT - New York Post

[jimotis4heisman]

Originally Posted by generaladm

I wish I had an answer for you, jo. I'm not sure if there is a clear cut dividing line between big and small businesses, at least as it pertains to the issues of the debate.

agree. devil in the details. details we havent seen. (from both canidates).

[generaladm]

I'm watching the post debate discussion with six undecided voters on NBC. One UV had a very good point that they wasted a good deal of the debate on the campaign tactics, when there's only three weeks left till the election. When they asked the UVs how many knew people who would not vote for Obama because of race, three raised their hands. When they were asked if they knew people who would not vote for McCain because of Palin, all six raised their hands.

[jlb1705]

As person who advises students in a teacher education program, I'll say that McCain's idea that veterans should be able to enter directly into teaching without passing PRAXIS tests or going through any other certification/licensure procedures sounds like a pretty bad one. Teachers need to have specific skills and dispositions and content knowledge to be effective, and those are things that you don't necessarily have to use or develop through military service.

I do think that bringing people into the education field after their military service is a commendable idea. I think the best way to accomplish that is for veterans to take full advantage of the new GI Bill that McCain opposed, that way veterans can get the necessary training to be successful and effective in the classroom and meet the standards that all teachers have to meet to get certified/licensed.

[JXC]

Fox News and CNN both have these groups of undecided voters that watch the debate. The groups are about 10 or 20 people. All of the people on both channels that made up their mind after the debate made up their mind for Obama. Nobody said McCain. And it seems like the Joe the Plummer thing did not impress them at all.

[CookyPuss]

Joe wasn't much impressed either:

AP's Phil Elliott tracks Joe down:
He's Joe Wurzelbacher, an Ohio man looking to buy a plumbing business who came to symbolize the middle class in Wednesday night's presidential debate between Barack Obama and John McCain....
So what does he have to say about literally being at the center of the debate.

He says his name being mentioned in the campaign is "pretty surreal."

Joe is still "uncommitted."

[sandgk]

Originally Posted by jlb1705

As person who advises students in a teacher education program, I'll say that McCain's idea that veterans should be able to enter directly into teaching without passing PRAXIS tests or going through any other certification/licensure procedures sounds like a pretty bad one. Teachers need to have specific skills and dispositions and content knowledge to be effective, and those are things that you don't necessarily have to use or develop through military service.

I do think that bringing people into the education field after their military service is a commendable idea. I think the best way to accomplish that is for veterans to take full advantage of the new GI Bill that McCain opposed, that way veterans can get the necessary training to be successful and effective in the classroom and meet the standards that all teachers have to meet to get certified/licensed.

jlb - absolutely agree - I thought that was one of the absolute worst exchanges of the night on below the radar issues.

It came across to me as -

Bad teachers who don't perform - kick 'em to the curb.

Uncertified folks - as long as they have military experience - let 'em in.

It was a bizarre contrast.

EDIT: And the second para you have - that is the right way to do this.

Perhaps McCain is still under the impression that the Webb sponsored GI Bill hasn't passed, otherwise ...

[generaladm]

Originally Posted by jlb1705

As person who advises students in a teacher education program, I'll say that McCain's idea that veterans should be able to enter directly into teaching without passing PRAXIS tests or going through any other certification/licensure procedures sounds like a pretty bad one. Teachers need to have specific skills and dispositions and content knowledge to be effective, and those are things that you don't necessarily have to use or develop through military service.

I do think that bringing people into the education field after their military service is a commendable idea. I think the best way to accomplish that is for veterans to take full advantage of the new GI Bill that McCain opposed, that way veterans can get the necessary training to be successful and effective in the classroom and meet the standards that all teachers have to meet to get certified/licensed.

I thought the same thing. There is no reason to believe that a person can jump right from any military experience into teaching without any training. I could see creating an accelerated program for veterans, perhaps waiving certain classes that would have parallels in their military service, but letting anyone into the classroom without passing a certification exam is ridiculous. To be honest, it sounded like something he made up on the spot.

[jlb1705]

Originally Posted by billmac91

CNN pundits thought this was McCain's best night, and Obama's worst for the most part. And CNN has called every debate for Obama.

I don't know if this was McCain's best night (or worst, or in the middle for that matter). I think he had his best moment tonight (when he first brought up Joe the Plumber) but I also think he had his worst moment tonight (his reaction to Obama's response on the health care "fine").

I don't think this was Obama's best night of the three, but I think it was good enough. Then again, I'm a partisan, I've long been decided and have in fact already cast my vote for him. I would have liked for him to be more aggressive in challenging some of McCain's assertions. I imagine there's a chance that Obama and his campaign feel that the approach he took will come across better to people who aren't like me who they think they can bring to their side.

[billmac91]

Any opinions on Charter schools? My girlfriend is a teacher at one in Cincinnati and it is an absolute mess. Truthfully, I don't know how bad the alternative is (public schools).

[sandgk]

CBS Poll:

CBS poll of undecided voters:
Who won the debate?
McCain (R) 22
Obama (D) 53
Shares your values
Obama, Before the debate: 54
Obama, After the debate: 63
McCain, Before the debate: 53
McCain, After the debate: 56


McCain improved after debate - not as much as Obama.


Obama a winner.


Poll

[JXC]

McCain saying that Palin's child has autism, when he has down's syndrome, not autism, was I think kind of bad on his part. If he is going to talk about something like this, he should know what Palin's son has.

[OSUsushichic]

Originally Posted by JXC

McCain saying that Palin's child has autism, when he has down's syndrome, not autism, was I think kind of bad on his part. If he is going to talk about something like this, he should know what Palin's son has.

Reporter: Do you realize you just said Palin's son had autism?
McCain: I cannot recall.