RB Speed (Split from MoC)

[Sloopy45]

LloydSev: "I guess Sloopy never watched Maurice play football.............. :\"

Yep. Other than every single down he played at OSU, I never saw him play.

Insert Point Here.

[gost8]

Originally Posted by Sloopy45

gost8: "I will still take those odds"

You'll take 500,000 to 1 odds?? You should go to Vegas. I hear Caesars needs a new West Wing added to the Casino.

Yeah I'll you two bucks that Maurice makes the team. If he doesn't its yours, if he does you owe me a million.

Originally Posted by Sloopy45

"There is a difference between a track guy that plays football and a football player that happens to also run track."

Point?

Just because you are fast doesn't mean you are a good football player.

Originally Posted by Sloopy45

First off, Maurice had everything in the world at Ohio State (women, celebrity, a bright future, money, etc.) & none of that was good enough to motivate him. So you're telling me (given this individual's history) that there's something, ANYTHING that tells us all (magically) that he won't act the same exact way now that he's set financially for life?

Maurice wasn't motivated at OSU???? He started as a freshman. He ripped teammates for not practicing hard enough. After he was suspended, motivation doesn't matter anymore. Geiger was not going to let him back on the team under any circumstances.

Originally Posted by Sloopy45

Are you reading what I write?? Where have I EVER said that speed is the be-all end-all factor for determining the productivity of a TB? Find it. BUT, my point is, it does help.

Originally Posted by Sloopy45

It doesn't matter if I've seen him practice. He's a TB who ran a 4.8 at the Combine. You really think he can make the team at that speed?

Translation, he can't make the team running 4.65 40. (What he is running NOW)

Originally Posted by Sloopy45

You really think Ginn runs a 4.4? Lets be serious. What he's 'listed at' & what's reality are two different things. And where did I ever say Clarett ran a 4.4? Go back and READ THOROUGHLY.

I said Clarett ran a 4.4. It is on the recruiting board. It also says Ginn ran a 4.45. What do you think Ginn runs?

AS I HAVE SAID COUNTLESS TIMES. 40 times are over rated.

Ben Johnson, who is believed to have run 40 yards faster than any human in history. Johnson is best known for injecting copious amounts of steroids and winning the 100 meters at the 1988 Olympics in Seoul in 9.79 seconds, only to have his gold medal and world record stripped after failing a post-race drug test. <dummy-1> </dummy-1> Timing officials have since broken down that famed race into 10-meter increments, and Johnson was so preposterously fast that he went through 50 meters in 5.52 seconds and 60 meters in 6.37 -- both under the current world records at those distances. He went through 40 yards that day in 4.38 seconds.

He was running in spikes . . . on a warm afternoon perfectly suited for sprinting . . . with a slight tailwind . . . with years of training from arguably track's top coach, Charlie Francis . . . with Carl Lewis and six others of the fastest men on the planet chasing him . . . with 69,000 people roaring at Seoul's Olympic Stadium . . . with hundreds of millions of people watching on TV . . . with the ultimate prize in sports, an Olympic gold medal, at stake.

And, as we learned later, with muscles built with the assistance of the anabolic steroid stanazolol.

Four-point-three-eight seconds.

Then again, maybe Ben Johnson isn't the fastest 40-yard man in the world.

Maybe half the NFL is faster.

[Sloopy45]

gost8: "Yeah I'll you two bucks that Maurice makes the team. If he doesn't its yours, if he does you owe me a million."

In my first post on this fiasco, I said that Clarett is guaranteed not to be cut.

"Just because you are fast doesn't mean you are a good football player."

I never said anything of the sort.

"Maurice wasn't motivated at OSU????"

No. Just because he played for 5 months and was great doesn't mean jack. He wasn't motivated enough to keep his nose clean. He wasn't motivated enough to keep his mouth shut. He wasn't even motivated enough to show up in shape at his first combine.

Anyone can be motivated for a short period of time. You have to show NFL teams that you are consistently motivated to excel over a period of time. He didn't.

"I said Clarett ran a 4.4. It is on the recruiting board. It also says Ginn ran a 4.45. What do you think Ginn runs?"

I dunno. 4.2?

[gost8]

Originally Posted by Sloopy45

gost8: "Yeah I'll you two bucks that Maurice makes the team. If he doesn't its yours, if he does you owe me a million."

In my first post on this fiasco, I said that Clarett is guaranteed not to be cut.

OK then, to answer your first question. Do you think MoC will make the team running a 4.8 40? YES

Second, I don't consider this a fiasco. Just two adults having a civil conversation about something they see differently. If you consider it anything else, I apologize.
I agree with you that speed helps a player in certain situations... but disagree with you that the player can't be productive because he lacks the extra 2/10's of a second.

Originally Posted by Sloopy45

No. Just because he played for 5 months and was great doesn't mean jack. He wasn't motivated enough to keep his nose clean. He wasn't motivated enough to keep his mouth shut. He wasn't even motivated enough to show up in shape at his first combine.

Anyone can be motivated for a short period of time. You have to show NFL teams that you are consistently motivated to excel over a period of time. He didn't.

He has excelled in football every year he has played. He showed up in good shape at the combine. Just not the shape condusive to running a fast 40, which he is working on changing now. (and has knocked off almost 2/10's off his 40)

Originally Posted by Sloopy45

I dunno. 4.2?

So you think Ginn is faster than Ben Johnson on steroids? Not only faster but over a tenth faster? By your standards Johnson is leaps and bounds slower than Ginn and Ginn would also be the fastest human on Earth.... ever.

[BuckeyeNation27]

So you think Ginn is faster than Ben Johnson on steroids? Not only faster but over a tenth faster? By your standards Johnson is leaps and bounds slower than Ginn and Ginn would also be the fastest human on Earth.... ever.

if youre going to use this to discredit a 4.2...you can use it just as easily to discredit whatever Clarett is running now.

[Sloopy45]

gost8: "OK then, to answer your first question. Do you think MoC will make the team running a 4.8 40? YES"

Dude, he's a 3rd Round Pick! No team is going to admit a mistake this early and cut a 3rd Round Pick!! Have you been even remotely understanding the gist of my post in the first place??

Did the Giants cut Ron Dayne when they got him into camp and realized that he ain't [censored]?? You completely missed my point. Its like talking to a brick wall. Conversation over.

"but disagree with you that the player can't be productive because he lacks the extra 2/10's of a second."

Again. You're either not reading my posts or you're unable to understand my point. A player can be productive (like Emmitt Smith) at a 4.8 speed. HOWEVER, it is more LIKELY that a player with a 4.5 speed will make an NFL roster and be productive than a player that runs a 4.8. Repeat: IT IS MORE LIKELY!!! MUCH MORE LIKELY!! Do you understand???

It is the exception that a 4.8 player (like Smith or Priest Holmes) becomes a great TB, not the rule.

"He has excelled in football every year he has played. He showed up in good shape at the combine."

You obviously haven't followed the situation at all. At his FIRST combine (last year, not this year) he showed up miserably out of shape, 25 pounds heavier, with love handles and a pot belly.

"So you think Ginn is faster than Ben Johnson on steroids? Not only faster but over a tenth faster?"

Dude, its a different standard of measure. 40 times are NFL/college/HS football speak. Your mention of Ben Johnson is pointless. You can't compare a track star's times with what is measured at a football camp/combine. I don't give a [censored] (and don't know) what each individual's ACTUAL 40 times are. I know what's reported, and what I see.

And this is relevant to nothing in the conversation. Who cares about Ben Johnson? You're trying to discredit NFL 40 times. Ok, done. Next post, write me a paper on how the NBA lists players as taller than they actually are.

[gost8]

THIS IS THE POST I HAVE BEEN REFERRING TO THIS WHOLE THREAD!!!! CAN YOU READ????

Originally Posted by Sloopy45

It doesn't matter if I've seen him practice. He's a TB who ran a 4.8 at the Combine. You really think he can make the team at that speed?

Meaning? You don't think he can make the team at 4.8. I don't know how else you can take that post. Well I guess maybe he thought he couldn't make it at that speed either because he has recently run in the 4.6 range. Look it up.

Originally Posted by Sloopy45

You obviously haven't followed the situation at all. At his FIRST combine (last year, not this year) he showed up miserably out of shape, 25 pounds heavier, with love handles and a pot belly.

He didn't participate in the 2004 combine. It didn't matter if he ran a 4.1 or 5.1 in 2004 because he couldn't play anywhere regardless. He was in shape for the combine before the draft he was eligible for.

Originally Posted by Sloopy45

Again. You're either not reading my posts or you're unable to understand my point. A player can be productive (like Emmitt Smith) at a 4.8 speed. HOWEVER, it is more LIKELY that a player with a 4.5 speed will make an NFL roster and be productive than a player that runs a 4.8. Repeat: IT IS MORE LIKELY!!! MUCH MORE LIKELY!! Do you understand???

MoC is at 4.6 range.... not 4.8... Do you understand??? By that start of the season he will likely, much more likely to be even faster. Can you comprehend this???


As for the rest of your dribble, it amounts to this....
The Broncos made a huge mistake drafting MoC in the third round because now they CAN NOT cut him if he doesn't pan out (which he will not because he ran a 4.8 40), because of the shear humiliation they will suffer. They also are paying him too much, thereby destroying his motivation to succeed. Every other RB that has ran a 40 slower than 4.5 and produced in the NFL is an exception to my "rule." Here I will give you a hand full of other backs I can remember that were not very successful (according to you, only because they weren't fast enough) to prove my point that Maurice won't be. Another. If they would have drafted him in the sixth or seventh round and gave him league minimum, he would have had so much more motivation to try harder.Third and biggest (Oh wait, Parcells was going to pick him up in the 4th so Denver would not have even got him.)

As for how he is doing....

"He's got a big head," tight end Jeb Putzier said.

On the surface, inflammatory remarks. But Putzier motioned his hands as he spoke those words, clearly referring to the physical size of Clarett's cranium rather than any ego-related issues.

Truth be told, what Putzier did see of the Broncos' only first-day offensive draftee impressed him.

"He was running by me today and he was working hard and that's all you can look at right now is to make sure they're working hard for our team," Putzier said. "He looks like he's ready to work."

The arrival of Clarett was topic A in a media room that saw ESPN and NFL Network crews join the usual assortment of local media outlets present for the day's activities.

But in the locker room, it wasn't a big deal.

"I think it's more a curiosity factor with the fans," cornerback Lenny Walls said. "I don't think the players or teammates go as far as the media and the fans may go. I have people already asking me, 'What's up with Clarett?' I'm like, 'He's not even here yet! Let him show up and practice a little bit.'"

The main issue for Clarett -- who was not available for comment Monday -- was getting back on the field after over two years away. A suspension in the 2003 season kept him off the practice field, and he sat out all of 2004 while in the limbo that accompanied his eventually rebuffed legal challenge to the draft's early-entry system.

In the two years and three months since the Fiesta Bowl, Clarett's work was limited to individual workouts, so Head Coach Mike Shanahan knows that it might take a while for the rookie to round into shape.

"I think it takes a little bit more time," Shanahan said. "Anytime a guy hasn't been on the field for a couple of years, there's a little transition time."

But that being said, he was pleased with Clarett's performance in the first day.

"Watching him today, it looked like things came very natural for him," Shanahan said. "He's got excellent hands, and it was a good first day for him.

"He'll be in shape by the time we start camp, and he could be in very good shape right now," Shanahan added. "He looked pretty good out there today."

And if Walls' perspective is any indicator of the entire locker room's mood, Clarett's NFL transition will be smooth inside that environment, as well.

"I'm going to treat him like any other rookie. Hopefully he can help this team. That's the bottom line," Walls said. "I'm just going to welcome him in. ... Even off the field I'm one of the coolest guys on this team; everybody knows that."

SOUNDS UNMOTIVATED TO ME.

[Sloopy45]

gost8: "Meaning? You don't think he can make the team at 4.8."

I've said this 100 times. Now 101. Even if he doesn't make the team, HE WON'T GET CUT. They'll send him to NFL Europe for a couple years, give him the money, and coddle him some more.

And, if he does indeed run a 4.8 (which he did at the combine), HE WILL NOT MAKE THE BRONCOS. He will be playing for the Euro-Trash Snapdragons, or whatever team it is. But, you tell me he's running a 4.6, so I believe you.

REPEAT: IF YOU TELL ME HE'S RUNNING A 4.6, I BELIEVE YOU!! BUT HE RAN A 4.8 to a 5.1 AT THE COMBINE!! HE WALKED OUT OF THE COMBINE B/C HIS PERFORMANCE WAS SO POOR!!

I love how you're completely disregarding any Combine performance this kid has had, any transgression this kid has had, and purely focusing on the few positives he's had in his career.

Did he play during his last two years of eligibility? Did he have a stellar workout at the combines? What are the answers to these questions?

"He didn't participate in the 2004 combine. It didn't matter if he ran a 4.1 or 5.1 in 2004 because he couldn't play anywhere regardless. He was in shape for the combine before the draft he was eligible for."

He sure as damn well showed up at the '04 Combine! You don't know your "facts" .. this was before his Draft Eligibility was overturned in the courts. He had very poor pre-draft interviews and couldn't complete the work outs, so he walked out prematurely. For the first of 2 times, I might add.

Dude, I'm gonna buy you Hooked on Phonics so you can learn to read:

"The Broncos made a huge mistake drafting MoC in the third round because now they CAN NOT cut him if he doesn't pan out "

The Broncos CAN cut him, but they won't.

"(which he will not because he ran a 4.8 40)"

DUMMY! (Its like Fred Sanford talking to Lamont): Did he, or did he not run a 4.8 at the Combine? Yes or No. Answer that, please.

"SOUNDS UNMOTIVATED TO ME."

Okay, you're right. Maurice is a great guy. He didn't try to rat out the Program. He's been in shape and a model citzen for the past 3 years. He didn't throw away possibly 2 Heismans. He is the fastest running back on this earth, and if he works hard enough (as he ALWAYS has been all about working hard), he can reduce his 40 time to a 4.2 and be faster than Ben Johnson and Ted Ginn.

Can someone please send me the Magic Maurice Elixir that drops your 40 time? I figure it this way: if I drink enough of it, I can drop my 40 time to a 3.9 and then work out for an NFL team.

I'm just confused as to why every NFL player doesn't drink the Maurice Elixir to drop their 40 times as well.