WolverineMike
Head Coach
billmac91;2336623; said:
Allow me to rephrase:
The only thing remarkable were the talking heads thinking those guys you listed would be able to push this series to possibly seven games.
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- Thread starter HabaneroBuck
- Start date
Allow me to rephrase:
The only thing remarkable were the talking heads thinking those guys you listed would be able to push this series to possibly seven games.
buckeyesin07
Veni. Vidi. Vici.
BengalsAndBucks;2336645; said:
Iman Shumpert is on line 1. Along with countless other players in several sports that have come back from an ACL tear more quickly than Rose. If he's not confident, that's on him as a competitor.
Because Rose already had his shirt handed to him by the Heat in the playoffs two years ago, when he was the supposed NBA MVP and the Bulls had the best record in the NBA. You're underestimating the egos on these players if you don't think Rose realizes this would be another stain on his "no playoff accomplishments" resume.
I agree they weren't challenging the Heat with or without Rose this year, but they won't challenge the Heat next year either. At least not without the addition of someone who can actually lead that team. Rose peaked two years ago, and even then wasn't that impressive (at least not as far as playoff runs--you know, what really matters in the NBA--are concerned).
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buckeyesin07;2336671; said:
Comparing his recovery to any other player's injury recovery is pretty asinine. Every body heals differently. I feel like Adrian Peterson's miracle is skewing everyone's understanding of how serious torn ACLs are, and how long they take to recover from. If Rose isn't confident his body is fully healthy, maybe that's a lack of understanding of his body, but I don't think it speaks at all to him as a competitor. Also, the differences in Rose's playing style and Shumpert's are pretty drastic and probably play a part in why one is more comfortable coming back sooner.
In 2010 they won two series and then lost to the Heat in 5, not a terrible showing. And saying Rose peaked two years - no shit, his MVP year was his best yet? He played 39 games the next year with nagging injuries the whole time and then sat the last season. So he's had half a season playing since he "peaked". He's 24 and has been in the NBA for 5 years, counting this one where he didn't play at all. Assuming he comes back fully healthy, he still hasn't reached his ceiling yet because if he can improve his 3PT%, which he'd done by ~50bp his first three years in the league, he becomes almost impossible to guard.
I gave my thoughts on the Bull's offseason earlier in the thread, but, a team with Butler/Deng/Noah is good enough defensively to compete with anyone, and just Rose coming back allows them to score some easy points every game, which is what the current team desperately lacks and makes them potent enough offensively. If they make the right moves in FA I think they certainly "challenge" the Heat next year and have a realistic shot at beating them.
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http://www.sbnation.com/nba/2015/7/...-bulls-contract-rumors-restricted-free-agency
I can understand why restricted FA is good for NBA teams, but I wonder if there's a better way to handle it for the players. Maybe something like the NFL format where you flag a guy with a certain value and then if he accepts an offer elsewhere that team has to give up assets to get him.
i.e. If Butler had a grade of 2-3 first round picks would a team sign him and give up the picks? The qualifying offers should also be based on the grade so if Butler took the QO it would be for close to max deal money rather than 125% of what he made last year. You could maybe put a point system on the picks to try to make the value equal.
Tier 1 - 2 lottery or 3 non lottery - 15 mil QO
Tier 2 - 1 lottery or 1 non lottery and 1 second round - 10 mil QO
Tier 3 - 1 non lottery or 2 second rounders - 5 mil QO
Tier 4 - 1 second rounder - 2.5 mil QO
If teams have cap space and wanted a player they could work out S&T deals to pay less than the tier or give up different assets. I guess the NFL also has Franchise Players so that stops guys from leaving, but becomes cost prohibitive if you keep using it on the same player. In Butler's case getting franchised would probably pay him 20 mil next year, which might be enough to earn he freedom.
I'd guess Butler's best bet would be to take the QO and hope for a max deal next year makes up for the 12 mil he loses this year or see if the Bulls would work out a 2 year deal for near max money and a player option for a 3rd year. If they stand pat on the 5 year max deal and he really wants out I'd take the QO and tell them to go fuck themselves. If they know he isn't going to be happy playing there and is going to take the QO it seems like they would be better finding a S&T so they get something back.
I can understand why restricted FA is good for NBA teams, but I wonder if there's a better way to handle it for the players. Maybe something like the NFL format where you flag a guy with a certain value and then if he accepts an offer elsewhere that team has to give up assets to get him.
i.e. If Butler had a grade of 2-3 first round picks would a team sign him and give up the picks? The qualifying offers should also be based on the grade so if Butler took the QO it would be for close to max deal money rather than 125% of what he made last year. You could maybe put a point system on the picks to try to make the value equal.
Tier 1 - 2 lottery or 3 non lottery - 15 mil QO
Tier 2 - 1 lottery or 1 non lottery and 1 second round - 10 mil QO
Tier 3 - 1 non lottery or 2 second rounders - 5 mil QO
Tier 4 - 1 second rounder - 2.5 mil QO
If teams have cap space and wanted a player they could work out S&T deals to pay less than the tier or give up different assets. I guess the NFL also has Franchise Players so that stops guys from leaving, but becomes cost prohibitive if you keep using it on the same player. In Butler's case getting franchised would probably pay him 20 mil next year, which might be enough to earn he freedom.
I'd guess Butler's best bet would be to take the QO and hope for a max deal next year makes up for the 12 mil he loses this year or see if the Bulls would work out a 2 year deal for near max money and a player option for a 3rd year. If they stand pat on the 5 year max deal and he really wants out I'd take the QO and tell them to go fuck themselves. If they know he isn't going to be happy playing there and is going to take the QO it seems like they would be better finding a S&T so they get something back.
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WolverineMike
Head Coach
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...um=referral&utm_campaign=programming-national
Chicago Bulls point guard Derrick Rose “is being sued by a woman who claims the NBA superstar and two of his friends drugged and gang raped her,” according to TMZ (warning: report contains graphic sexual content).
A spokesperson for Rose denied the allegations, calling the lawsuit “outrageous.”
The woman, reportedly identified as “Jane Doe” in the lawsuit, said she dated the Bulls star from 2011 to 2013. She alleged Rose and two friends slipped a drug into her drink at Rose’s Beverly Hills home.
TMZ reported “the plaintiff says she escaped the house with a friend, but later that night, Rose and his friends broke into her apartment and gang raped her while she was incapacitated. She said she remembers only ‘flashes’ of the incident, but can remember the defendants forcibly raping her.”
The woman also alleged that while Rose and her dated, he attempted to get her to perform various sexual acts for him, which she refused.
According to TMZ, the woman waited two years to file suit “because she was ‘ashamed and embarrassed’ of what happened and concerned her ‘conservative family’ would find out. She wants unspecified damages.”
A spokesperson for the point guard responded to the allegations, per Liz Mullen of SportsBusiness Journal:
The plaintiff’s allegations are completely false and without any factual basis. This is nothing more than a desperate attempt to shake down a highly respected and successful athlete. Mr. Rose was in a non-exclusive, consensual sexual relationship with the plaintiff for over two years. The plaintiff expressed no complaints about Mr. Rose until various lawyers began to surface and demand that the plaintiff be paid millions of dollars. ... This is the third lawyer the plaintiff has retained in this matter. Two years have passed since Mr. Rose ended the consensual relationship with the plaintiff, and her claims are as meritless now as they were two years ago. We have complete confidence that the case will be dismissed and that Mr. Rose will be vindicated. This lawsuit is outrageous.
Rose was the 2008-09 NBA Rookie of the Year and the 2010-11 NBA MVP. He has endorsement deals with Adidas, Powerade and Giordano’s, among others, and is one of the most recognizable players in the league and arguably the current face of the Bulls franchise.
Chicago Bulls point guard Derrick Rose “is being sued by a woman who claims the NBA superstar and two of his friends drugged and gang raped her,” according to TMZ (warning: report contains graphic sexual content).
A spokesperson for Rose denied the allegations, calling the lawsuit “outrageous.”
The woman, reportedly identified as “Jane Doe” in the lawsuit, said she dated the Bulls star from 2011 to 2013. She alleged Rose and two friends slipped a drug into her drink at Rose’s Beverly Hills home.
TMZ reported “the plaintiff says she escaped the house with a friend, but later that night, Rose and his friends broke into her apartment and gang raped her while she was incapacitated. She said she remembers only ‘flashes’ of the incident, but can remember the defendants forcibly raping her.”
The woman also alleged that while Rose and her dated, he attempted to get her to perform various sexual acts for him, which she refused.
According to TMZ, the woman waited two years to file suit “because she was ‘ashamed and embarrassed’ of what happened and concerned her ‘conservative family’ would find out. She wants unspecified damages.”
A spokesperson for the point guard responded to the allegations, per Liz Mullen of SportsBusiness Journal:
The plaintiff’s allegations are completely false and without any factual basis. This is nothing more than a desperate attempt to shake down a highly respected and successful athlete. Mr. Rose was in a non-exclusive, consensual sexual relationship with the plaintiff for over two years. The plaintiff expressed no complaints about Mr. Rose until various lawyers began to surface and demand that the plaintiff be paid millions of dollars. ... This is the third lawyer the plaintiff has retained in this matter. Two years have passed since Mr. Rose ended the consensual relationship with the plaintiff, and her claims are as meritless now as they were two years ago. We have complete confidence that the case will be dismissed and that Mr. Rose will be vindicated. This lawsuit is outrageous.
Rose was the 2008-09 NBA Rookie of the Year and the 2010-11 NBA MVP. He has endorsement deals with Adidas, Powerade and Giordano’s, among others, and is one of the most recognizable players in the league and arguably the current face of the Bulls franchise.
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ScriptOhio
Everybody is somebody else's weirdo.
Derrick Rose suffers orbital fracture; return timeline undetermined
Chicago Bulls guard Derrick Rose suffered a left orbital fracture during Tuesday's practice and will undergo surgery Wednesday, the team announced.
A timetable for his return will not be known until after the surgery, the Bulls said.
Rose sustained the injury when he took an elbow to the face, and he left practice early.
Coach Fred Hoiberg described it as "a good, hard elbow," before the extent of Rose's injury was known and said Rose "looked great when he was out there."
It is the latest injury setback for Rose since his 2010-11 MVP season. He signed a five-year max extension worth close to $95 million before the 2011-12 season but has played in only 100 regular-season games since then because of various injuries, including three serious knee injuries.
Rose missed 27 games in 2011-12 for a sprained toe, strained back, and groin, ankle and foot injuries before missing the entire 2012-13 season with a torn ACL.
Entire article: http://espn.go.com/chicago/nba/stor...ulls-suffers-orbital-fracture-undergo-surgery
Chicago Bulls guard Derrick Rose suffered a left orbital fracture during Tuesday's practice and will undergo surgery Wednesday, the team announced.
A timetable for his return will not be known until after the surgery, the Bulls said.
Rose sustained the injury when he took an elbow to the face, and he left practice early.
Coach Fred Hoiberg described it as "a good, hard elbow," before the extent of Rose's injury was known and said Rose "looked great when he was out there."
It is the latest injury setback for Rose since his 2010-11 MVP season. He signed a five-year max extension worth close to $95 million before the 2011-12 season but has played in only 100 regular-season games since then because of various injuries, including three serious knee injuries.
Rose missed 27 games in 2011-12 for a sprained toe, strained back, and groin, ankle and foot injuries before missing the entire 2012-13 season with a torn ACL.
Entire article: http://espn.go.com/chicago/nba/stor...ulls-suffers-orbital-fracture-undergo-surgery
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Ironically, I read a headline on the Cowherd Show saying that he "was ready to test the free agency market in 2017".
Good luck with that, I'm sure it's going to be the equivalent of Marshall's and K-Mart bidding for his signature at this point.
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OHSportsFan
Fan of Ohio Sports in Indy
The Last Dance starts on ESPN tonight. Hate the network but they do independent documents very well.
Grew up on the 90s Bulls (and Pacers/Knicks).
Grew up on the 90s Bulls (and Pacers/Knicks).
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Just watching those clips of him from the 80s and it's hilarious to me that anybody could think Lebron is better. It's not even close.
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