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High Buckeye Offense Expectations?

Discussion in 'Buckeye Football' started by Taosman, Mar 6, 2005.

  1. Taosman

    Taosman Endorsed Bye Cats On The Internet

    Does anyone think we are expecting too much from the 05 Buckeye offense? Sure, we got some terrific potential ,but remember this is still JT's play calling and style! And there's Troy Smith's temp probation and rust. And just look at the running backs available! This is not intended as a "sky is falling" post! I wonder about real expectations.
     
  2. osugrad21

    osugrad21 Capo Regime Staff Member

    Anyone expecting tOSU to be a Fun & Gun kind of team is setting themselves up for frustration and disappointment IMHO.

    As long as the improvement shown in the final two ballgames continues, the offense will be formidable.

    With all of the talent, there will be plenty of big plays...but don't expect JT to change his ways once he gets the lead.

    Just my opinion...Though I won't shed any tears if he unveils some high octane scoring machine and proves me wrong :biggrin:
     
  3. ScarletArrow

    ScarletArrow I'm wearing Gold Pants

    My expectation that our offense will not start where we left off in the last 2 games of 2005.

    By that I mean we probably won't use the shotgun and 3 and 4 WR formations as frequently early in the season.

    I think JT likes his offense to evolve as the season progresses, and you know he is going to take a "get back to basics approach" in solving the running game question the first two games of the season in preparation for Texas.
     
  4. LloydSev

    LloydSev DreamWeaver

    JT has always said he wants an offense with big play capabilities.
     
  5. OilerBuck

    OilerBuck Sweet Crude

    I think that only a small extremely optimistic remnant of Buckeye fans expect an explosive offense. That being said, you are probably on the opposite end of the spectrum in that you believe that the coaching style was our fatal flaw and that we can expect it to continue.

    Most of us that follow the Buckeyes realize that Tressel will call plays based on personnel. When our offensive line struggles, our QB has confidence issues and we have no real running threat, Tressel wants our offense to manage the ball and keep the game low scoring because he knows we can't keep up.

    Several developments led to JT putting more trust in our offense later in the season(hence scoring increases) 1.) The emergence of Ginn as an offensive force (not just special teams), 2.) The cohesiveness of the offensive line and 3.) Confidence in the quarterback position.

    I think that Ginn and the Offensive Line will BOTH be better than last year and I believe that the loss of Flydell is almost addition by subtraction but the running game will still be a notch below what Buckeye faithfull are used to. The quarterback position has taken a hit because of all the controversy surrounding Troy. Our best bet is to get Justin or Todd confidence in the Miami game by breaking a big lead right out of the gate and letting them throw without a lot of pressure. I still believe we will be a little timid at first against Texas, but by the end of that game we should know if we have a starter for the season or not.

    Even with Troy's suspension I believe we are looking at a dramatically improved offense at worst. Keep in mind that Tressel will never call the kind of devil-may-care offense like Kansas City or Indianapolis in the NFL because he doesn't see any sense in putting the defense in bad positions by taking needless chances. For that reason I believe we will have an offense that many teams will envy because of it's efficiency and controlled big-play ability.

    I do agree with you in that, thinking we will be Louisville or Boise State (offensively) is ridiculous because we have a defense that affords us the luxury of not needing to be.
     
  6. bucksn'boobs

    bucksn'boobs Rookie

    Last year's offense evolved and the coaching staff deserves credit for figuring out the right system to compliment these young guys with little game experience.We cannot forget that we lost our starting quarterback,tb,wr,te,rt,and a couple of NFL guards I believe. Tress and company turned the offense upside down after they finally realized that the running game was DEAD. I don't think he will wait for three consecutive loses this year to start changing things, but I do think we see more of a "traditional" attack at the beginning of the year. I am excited about our three young rb's, but I have to remind myself that two have never played a down of college football, and the third is injury prone, and rumored to have other baggage that could keep him off the field. Overall I am confident because the two most important pieces IMO seem to be there in a solid OL and an experienced qb (either one of them are fine with me).

    when in doubt...give it to 7!
     
  7. daddyphatsacs

    daddyphatsacs Let the cards fall... Staff Member

    The offense will be much more explosive this year. Tressel is lining up some depth at the skilled positions with absolute speed to burn. Fast skilled players = explosion, and big play potential. If the line plays well this year, we'll average 25 points a game.

    This team may be one of the fastest in college football this year.
     
  8. exactly (maybe i would have thrown in an "oppurtunistic" but you nailed it)
     
  9. jwinslow

    jwinslow A MAN OF BETRAYED JUSTICE Staff Member Tourney Pick'em Champ

    Keep in mind what happened in 02 when we had a healthy MoC:

    45, 51, 25, 23, 45, 27 (no MoC), 50 points in the first 7 games

    I think if our defense can hold up he's plenty willing to run up the score at home, especially considering how dangerous Texas, Iowa, and scUM are offensively (as well as MSU and others).

    Watch what happens next year if Erik Haw can be dependable (plus he has gamebreaking speed) in addition to everything else. It could get scary. Tresselball will be forever redefined.
     
  10. Yertle

    Yertle Pounding out aggression, turns into obsession

    Maybe it's my own way of preparing for the worst, but I'm with Taosman. I just don't see the Bucks fielding an offense that can be compared to the '98 team. I think the individual players are all there, but the play calling and coaching mentality isn't. And PLEASE, don't take that as a bash on Tressel or a compliment for Coop. How many games did Germaine throw for 300+ in 98? I think it was 8!!! How many games have a Tressel coached OSU team thrown for 300+? Actually, I don't know. I think they did it at Indiana in '03, but I don't know for sure. If so, that makes 1. If the Bucks don't have the dominating, unstoppable running attack, they won't put up big offensive numbers, IMO.

    I know there's a thread on Haw, but is it the popular oppinion that Haw will beat out Pittman?
     
    osugrad21 likes this.
  11. jwinslow

    jwinslow A MAN OF BETRAYED JUSTICE Staff Member Tourney Pick'em Champ

    Haw and Pittman are insanely fast, so that's not a consideration. Haw is a lot bigger than pittman so can run thru the middle more times per game.

    But the clincher is that Pittman showed up to spring practices out of shape and lacking motivation, whereas the staff is raving about Haw and are excited about seeing what he can do in spring ball.
     
  12. osugrad21

    osugrad21 Capo Regime Staff Member

    Nice post. Germaine threw 7 300 yd games in 98 but your point is made....and yes I would say the general opinion is for Haw right now.
     
  13. Yertle

    Yertle Pounding out aggression, turns into obsession

    Yeah, I just got done re-reading the Spring Training Rumors merged thread, and saw a lot of that regarding Pittman and Haw. That would obviously explain it. Oh well, if it's all true - then may the best Haw win.
     
  14. I was actually going to start a thread about how dangerous our "O" could be next year. so I will just put it in here.

    Ok let me break it down into positions

    QB

    Zwick - with him we get a kid that should have more confidence coming in this year, more so then last year and will have a chip on his shoulder trying to keep that job, so maybe he could just explode. If his ball wasnt so bad he could really be something great, but his mechanics are not very good. His best pass he threw all year was the long ball in the marshall game for an 80 yd. td. Zwick can really read a defense but that is really about it, but lets remember the line didnt block very well for him in the games he was in there. His couple drawbacks are that he is not very mobile in the pocket to elude the rush and he can't throw a frickin' spiral. I threw one when I was 7. Also the team didnt seem to back him as much as Smith. I think he could really come out and suprise us in the Miami came tho and then what do we do.

    with Smith you have a totally different offense. He always knows where #7 is even if he is rolling out, and he can really put pressure on a defense with being able to scramble. He throws the better ball and right now I think he is just there better QB. We will have to wait till spring to really decide.

    RB's

    Pittman - we have seen some glimpes of what he can do. He can explode to the outside, but he has shown he has some injury problems and likes to spend time in the doghouse. I think we really need him to at least put up 500-600 yds. on the season.

    Haw - which he seems to be the favorite right now I believe we have our best situation b/c we will have a decent size back with break away speed. Defenses will have to be good to stop him when running behind our new and improved offense line.

    If Mo Wells starts well that means he is one hell of a back to beat out two players that already have time in and he is going to be one hell of a back. I really hope that he gets here and learns the system so that he can log some quality time, b/c he too could be a defensive nightmare. I just have no idea what to expect of him.


    OL

    The UNIT -

    LT - This is up for grabs it could go to Sims, Rehring or Boone. Sims playing here will depend on wheter they like him better at G over another guard or whether they think the line is better with Boone or Rehring here and Sims at guard. If Boone comes in and starts for us our line could be one of the best we have seen here in a long time.

    LG - Downing came on at the end of last season and will continue to be a beast for us this season. Don't look for him to come out much.

    C - Mangold he has been there for us since his freshmen year and don't look for that to change. He could win some awards next season if we have a good year.

    RG - This position goes to Sims, Mitchum, or Datish. See above for Sims. There have been raving reports about Mitchum and not so much about Datish and he had a sub par season last year being replaced by downing. If Mitchum is as good as advertised well then he gets this spot and Sims stays at tackle.

    RT - Barton came on the same way that Downing did last season so look for him to stay in a lot also.

    I think best scenario is (Boone, Downing, Mangold, Sims, Barton) but I believe it will be (Sims, Downing, Mangold, Mitchum, Barton) which is not bad at all. These guys just need to keep on showing us that cohesion they showed us at the end of last year.

    TE's

    Hamby - I hope he can have a great year blocking this year, If he could seal the end more often like he did on Mo Halls td run against MSU we will be in great shape. A lot of the reason Flydell could never get outside was because the ends were stimating Hamby at the line. He has great hands and could catch some balls to help out stretching the field.

    Hall - This could be the wildcard in our whole offensive scheme. If he can play this position you find me a safety or lb that can cover him. Motion him out and match him up against a 5'10'' safety and can we say touchdown.

    Frost - See above with Hall. One of these guys has to step up. It would be the match that starts the bombfire this offense could have.

    WR's

    MAN O MAN :) WHERE DO I START.

    Holmes - Great playmaker as we have seen the last two years he runs great routes and has great speed. He could see a lot of double or a lot of single coverage this year. Depending on who teams want to beat them. Just let me tell you one thing you can put single coverage on him. Just ask Marlin Jackson. Isnt he suppossed to be an NFL corner.

    Ginn - He is one in a billion. God I can't stop smiling when I think about the potential this kid has. It is like thinking about Lebron James in basketball. He hasnt even started to reach into his bag of tricks. I mean he is the fastest player I have ever watch be able to display the moves he can. Just watch the clips from last year. I mean on the punt returns those guys are in their lanes he just makes great moves to get by them. He reminds of the kid in grade school that is fast and all the slow white kids are trying to two hand tag him. Man just think about when they start double teaming him. Leaving open Holmes. Or vice versa. I also believe by the end of the year Lyons will be lining up on the outside and Ginn and Gonzo will be in the slots.

    Gonzo - Great speed. Think Brandon Stoakley of the Colts, but faster. He will line up against lb's and safeties and they won't be able to stop him from getting open.

    Lyons - Man would I love for him to step up and be able to play wide across from Holmes and have Ginn in the slot with gonzo in the other slot or Hall or Frost at Te. OMG.

    Jordan - don't really know what to expect we will see come spring. Same with the frosh but we will see in the fall.


    Ok so anyone with a defensive scheme to stop this offense can let me know. I will just give you a couple of examples.

    Our lineup is

    QB - Smith RB - Haw Wr's - Holmes, Ginn, Gonzo, Te - Hall.

    You try playing a base 4-3.

    couple scenarios:

    1. man 2 man with 2 free. - so holmes and ginn are covered by cb which they can eat alive all day. Gonzo gets a lb or safety which he can eat alive and stretch the field and Hall gets a lb which he can eat alive. It gets even better if they blitz b/c then there is only one free meaning more spaces for our receivers.

    2. Then they bring in an extra cb b/c Gonzo is just shredding the lb and ginn and holmes shread single coverage. Then with a nickel package. You are running against 6 in the box. and Haw runs all over the field because there is so many open holes to find. Then they bring the safeties up and bye bye ginn and Holmes.

    3. They play a base 4-3 and put zone behind it - Then we find the open spots and pick them apart. run the drags with gonzo and Hall and with speed they make them plays turn into 15 yarders. And if they run cover two you get ginn and Holmes with soft coverage on the outside on there hitches and outs and they can get big gains. causing the lbs to widen out causing the middle of the field to be wide open causing big gains for Hall up the middle. Then they go to nickel and bring in the extra db to try and match up speed wise and we dominate on the ground.


    Do you guys see how this will work next year. I have even gotten to the power I formation which we will see alot of and we will have a powerful fb to fill the holes and open up some big ones with Haw and pittmans speed to bust it to the outside and the cb's off because they are scared of the long ball and the safeties staying deep b/c of that too well Haw has a field day with 7 in the box. Or they creep up the safety and have 8 in the box and then you get man coverage with the 6'4'' te on the safety. I will take that match up all day.


    Lets not forget about the possibility of having to watch troy Smith from escaping out of the pocket and running for 15 or our trick plays so the ends will have to come up the field causing the middle running lanes to be open.

    I think the only thing that keep this offense from being explosive is JT. I agree with the people above that say he calls the plays to the level of skill he has on the field and it don't matter what he calls if it is a simple 5 yd. hitch to Holmes or Ginn, b/c both can go to the house, or a simple off tackle b/c Haw or Pittman can also go to the house. We are just going to have to cherish what we will have this year. Also when we play scUM they might have Brandon Harrison starting and that would be a great time to see Lyons get a couple of Jump Balls.
     
  15. Oneshot

    Oneshot Goes For Three

    Ginn in the slots? No. Way.

    How would you like to see Teddy 2 smacked in the knees every other play when he goes across the middle. I'm not calling him a wuss by ANY means, but he's just physically thinner and less stocky than some of the other receivers.

    Ginn and Santonio at wide out would be ridiculous. They would be making safeties cry at night.
     

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