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- Thread starter jlb1705
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No, depending on the circumstances I'd probably laugh at her, or if she really popped me a good one--for no good reason--I may slap her back...dead fucking serious. My thing is when women do an true assault on a guy and then file charges when she even gets pushed back.
Have you seen the viral video of the white chick (Army Reserve Captain) who cut some local Hawaiian guy off in a parking lot and proceeded to go ever to his car while he was videoing her and slapped the guy? If some wild chick went all road-rage on me, then I may step it up and treat her like an adult male.
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OH10
*
I don't think you realize how broad you've brushed this topic with that position. This isn't physics where every action has an equal and opposite reaction - especially when the reaction isn't generally equal. Humans have the ability and responsibility to act rationally and appropriate to any particular situation, each of which has to be judged on its own circumstances
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OSUK
Sometimes lucid, mostly confused
You reapply until repentence is achieved - and you increase the intensity of it until you get that result. You have to make it clear that you are willing to do it all day. That's why you use a very light object. We found flat wooden spoons made of light wood produced a good sting, but would not leave any kind of mark (in Ohio if there is "tissue damage" that meets the legal definition of abuse).
But if you aren't willing to spank with the intensity that allows you to find the threshhold that brings the child to repentence, you shouldn't use it as a tool because it will not work. But if that and the other criteria are in place, it produces well-behaved children that are under the authority of their parents.
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OSUK
Sometimes lucid, mostly confused
Taking autism and mental illness out of the equation, the only people I know who have been hit by their children are those who were non-spankers.
On the surface it would seem logical and simple that hitting children would produce children who hit, but actually the opposite is true in my observation and experience. The key is who is doing the hitting and why. When an authority appropriately uses physical force to correct, control, and bring someone into acceptable boundaries of behavior, it does not produce violence, but rather respect for authority - which negates violence toward that authority. If the premise that spanking children produces violent behavior were true, one would expect that appropriate police actions would do the same - which doesn't seem as much of a logical or simple truth.
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AuTX Buckeye
Founder & Pres of the Flemming/Holtmann Fan Club
Yahoo Pickem Champ
Former Game Champion
Pretty interesting breakdown
http://fivethirtyeight.com/datalab/...nking-vary-by-party-race-region-and-religion/
I hate the fact this place is owned or run by ESPN but love the stats and the breakdowns they give
http://fivethirtyeight.com/datalab/...nking-vary-by-party-race-region-and-religion/
I hate the fact this place is owned or run by ESPN but love the stats and the breakdowns they give
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OSUK
Sometimes lucid, mostly confused
That is some really good stuff. The NE and W have an ideological partnership, as does the MW and S. The other stuff is common sense: religious/conservative people are going to largely be spankers and non-religious/liberal people aren't.
Here's the thing - every pediatric, psychological, and psychiatric group is anti-spanking. I can't even remember the last time I heard any kind of positive story in the media about the benefits of spanking. Every "expert" on the subject either condemns spanking or discourages it. And yet, about 3 out of every 4 people still support a parent's right to spank. IOW, people don't believe the experts - and I believe it is because what the experts say do not line up with what people know from experience. The anti-spankers keep quoting their studies, and people keep saying, "Yeah, right."
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t_BuckeyeScott
Hall of Fame
I have 4 kids, 3 girls and 1boy, ages: 9,8,4,3.
We spank. Our kids aren't perfect. What they are is: well behaved, happy, polite, and good natured. They trust and adore both of us (sometimes I find it hard to believe, but they really do). We never strike out of anger and rarely have ever had to hold down a child for the spanking, they receive nothing until they submit.
My oldest, was the hardest. For a while she refused to submit to her mother. I had to come home from work once. One of the few times I used something other than my hand. From then on, if she didn't submit to her mother she received a belt spanking from me when I got home and still had to receive the correction from her mother. This only happened a couple of more times. She learned. She is not sullen or distrustful of us. She is happy and healthy.
A family we are fairly close with prefers to watch our kids over there brother and sisters kids because our kids mind and they are happy, grateful, and fun.
This all has nothing to do with hitting a grown adult. You are not entrusted to train adults in the same way as children.
No real need to reconcile for me.
Also I want to give my wife all the credit possible for the state of our children.
We spank. Our kids aren't perfect. What they are is: well behaved, happy, polite, and good natured. They trust and adore both of us (sometimes I find it hard to believe, but they really do). We never strike out of anger and rarely have ever had to hold down a child for the spanking, they receive nothing until they submit.
My oldest, was the hardest. For a while she refused to submit to her mother. I had to come home from work once. One of the few times I used something other than my hand. From then on, if she didn't submit to her mother she received a belt spanking from me when I got home and still had to receive the correction from her mother. This only happened a couple of more times. She learned. She is not sullen or distrustful of us. She is happy and healthy.
A family we are fairly close with prefers to watch our kids over there brother and sisters kids because our kids mind and they are happy, grateful, and fun.
This all has nothing to do with hitting a grown adult. You are not entrusted to train adults in the same way as children.
No real need to reconcile for me.
Also I want to give my wife all the credit possible for the state of our children.
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Muck
Enjoy Every Sandwich
Why do you feel a need reconcile them? The two have nothing in common outside of a single superficial detail.
It's no different than the inane "how can you support capital punishment but be against abortion" (or more rarely, vice versa) argument.
The two are not related.
Well if you're my mom then you wait until my dad gets home and scream at him until he whips me just to shut you up.
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This has been an interesting thread so far.
I've never spanked my kid. But, I'm only sort of against it. My wife will tell you, "We don't do that in my house" -- but I think she'd cross the line before I would. But I'm only sort of against it in that I don't want to go there unless I feel like that's right answer.
At any rate, like some have mentioned, my mom spanked, belted, wooden spooned, hair brushed my butt... more than one bloody nose from being smacked in the face for having a smart mouth... it was fine, the context was right... I knew she wasn't trying to hurt me.
On the other hand, my kid knows when I grab her arm (and yeah, I take a very firm grip, but don't yank or pull or anything) in the parking lot....
BuckStocks comments are interesting... and I think its all to do with presentation and messaging. I used to make fun of the "time out" people, or the go to your room people... (I never got the counting thing, other than I did it a couple times just for fun and it worked, and I have no idea why)... but, back to the hug after thing, I mean, with my kid... the timeout works in some cases because its not just a "stop what you're doing" -- if your kid knows you love them and have their best interest in mind, whether you spank them or ground them or time out them, and you impress upon them what it is they've done wrong and why they can't continue to do it, and if appropriate why they've disappointed you and that their behavior impacts you too because you love them... its going to be effective.
But, then you have to parse out discipline and compelling behavior. And they aren't always the same thing. I had a conversation with a friend about... and I think this was in the preschool days... about a "stranger" disciplining his kid. And I mean, I just don't think "strangers" can do that. There's no trust there. They can (and at preschool or day care) and need to compel a certain behavior at a specific time, and I think parents do too (I mean every little thing isn't a freaking life learning moment)... So I don't worry about that all that much because your average stranger isn't gonna have that relationship. (Teachers fall across that spectrum). To me there lies a difference between a punishment and a consequence, as well... though they can take the same form. Taken with no context, If you asked my kid whether she'd rather have no TV for a week or to get spanked, she'd "get it over with" -- so that only would give me one chance to impress my point rather than a week's worth.
There will come a day - and my daughter is 7 so it is rapidly approaching - where I won't have to spank them anymore to get their attention when they are doing something dangerous/stupid that could hurt themselves or others. I will be the happiest Dad in the world when that day arrives.
I've noticed, as has my wife, that we have very well behaved children. They reason well on their own and we've watched them both talk themselves out of doing something that would get them into trouble. We try to encourage the good behavior instead of saying "If you aren't good, this will happen..." and highlighting the bad behavior. That has seemed to work with them.
Although in the end, I think it comes down to the kid him or her self. Some kids need the extra oomph, some kids get the message with positive reinforcement. I would imagine it varies from kid to kid.
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I've seen this question posed to me a couple times in this thread. I've refrained from replying until now because I've wanted to take some time to read the responses here and reflect for myself.
I was approaching the question from this standpoint: that the act of striking a woman (or man for that matter) is only justified in cases where one's own safety or the safety of others is jeopardized and there is no other expedient way to address the situation. Given that stance, how could I justify striking a child under disciplinary circumstances, especially when a child is even less capable of causing danger and less capable of defending his or herself than all but the weakest of adults?
I don't feel that the commonalities between striking an adult and striking a child are superficial details. How can the act itself be a superficial detail? The differences are the most important thing though, and some of the responses in this thread have helped me to understand them better. I feel it's important to understand what the two things have in common though in order to better appreciate the differences and be on more solid moral footing.
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Muck
Enjoy Every Sandwich
Are you using Bruce Lee's 1" punch or breaking out Dim Mak on your kids?
When you are fighting to protect someone do you sharply swat the aggressor's hand or bottom to get their attention? Employ elaborate theater or ceremony to emphasis the event?
I think there is a relatively simple answer to your question. If you are unable to distinguish between the disparate methods & intent of the two then your best option would be not to employ either.
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Oh, yeah, I mean one thing I do realize is that I only have one kid. Which, as old people like to tell me, doesn't make me a real parent (and that's fine, I have no such aspiration). But, 1 kid or 2 kids or 6 kids have different discipline requirements, if only to manage time.
Do disciplining your child is or isn't like Fred Sanford and Grady going at it?
Rowdy Roddy Piper and King Kong Bundy?
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Muck
Enjoy Every Sandwich
If it looks like this when you spank your child...
...you're doing it wrong (and your wife probably cheated on you).
Smart ass quips aside, my previous post was completely sincere. If you have misgivings (whatever their reason) about spanking your child, then you shouldn't do it.
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I didn't intend to mock, I was just thinking about the difference between a fight and spanking and I had this realization that a fake fight might not make sense to a kid... in Kindergarten (I think) my kid was on the play ground with 2 boys doing the "we're gonna fight" dance (Fred and Grady level I suspect) and well, she didn't realize that's what boys do... they dance around it and don't do anything, to her it was real enough that she punched them both.
Why?
She didn't want them to get in a fight.
Which worked... well... and a call from school... but, I digress.
(Its got nothing to do with what you're talking about and your point was well made, that's just where I was coming from)
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