OT Isaiah Prince (All B1G)

[Bestbuck36]

I'm not an OL technique expert but when I watch prince, it's not like he's so slow he can't get his hands on a good pass rusher, he gets beat after contact (as it were). I'm hoping that's just a strength and technique issue. I also see him more than hold his own against a lot of guys. All in all, the kid is big as a house and athletic enough (I think) to play T at this level. Not sure why it isn't clicking but I feel like there is reason for optimism there.

On a side note, I feel awful for the kid. You see the look on his face sometimes and know he's just dying out there. It's not like he wants to go out there and fail in front of 100K people, I think he's taking one for the team by playing when he isn't quite ready yet. Pridgeon's injury contributed to this situation and the guys a year older that haven't stepped up should be the ones who feel the worst about watching a true sophomore having to get his teeth kicked in like this and the team suffer for it as well.

Exhawg is probably better positioned to answer this but in my opinion, it's his hands and feet not working together at times. He has to get his kick down pat so that he's on an even base when he makes his punch on that edge rusher. When he's off balance he ends up reaching too much and overbalances and thats where he loses his leverage on the guy so he goes right around him. If you really watch him, he rarely gets beat on the inside, if ever. That initial kick on the pass play has to gain more ground and he has to keep his feet moving to cut that guy off or even better ride the guy completely around and out of the play so JT can step up clean and either take off or get a clear throwing lane.

Against mich they had a LB spy JT so when that rush made him step up, the LB was only a couple yards away and he came on a delay A LOT. Taco got the praise but it was a combination of knowing Taco was going to make JT step up and the LB could just fill that void and be all over JT in a split second. Hate to say it but that is just a great gameplan well executed. We have to make the adjustments like everyone has said and get back to dictating to the defense intead of reacting to them.

 

[Bestbuck36]

I too feel bad for Prince and confidence has just as much to do with it... they need to help him out and if they don't down the stretch here and they leave him out to dry again and we give up similar sack numbers then shame on the staff.

Who cares if it's obvious what you are doing (rolling away from prince, slide protecting to his side, keeping people on his side for help) because everything will be disrupted and fucked if we allow people to cave in our right side.

Side note I firmly believe this has every bit to do with JTs struggles as anything. Against a good pass rushing NW we helped Prince out with Bowen and JT went 21/32 for 225 yards which is perfect.

EVERY game JT struggles in its because he can't even set his damn feet. MSU last year, MSU this year, scum 16, Indiana 16, Penn state in 14 and 16, and even Wisconsin to an extent this year.

Further proof look at the stats of JT In both halves of the Wisconsin game. First half he's under pressure and he doesn't amount to anything and in the second half we sure things up and JT starts to get the ball down field.

QBs will miss open guys once in a while but they're going to miss exponentially when you have a 280 pound defensive end crashing in.

IMO it's not JT, it's not our receivers, and it's not Princes fault. The other teams know we will not help out a struggling offensive line and if we can't pass the ball they KNOW we will be content running JT at them which is what they want. To make us 1 dimensional and for the life of me I do not understand our stubbornness with things.

I give it to our defensive staff they seem to adjust better this year and IMO it's because of Greg. When teams went heavy on us this year after the Wisconsin game we put in a extra backer and took off a DB. When people put their play maker in the slot we put Conley there and brought in Ward to man outside.

So why has the offense lagged behind in figuring out how to counter people?

Seems to me we are reacting instead of dictating. The team that imposes their will usually wins and we've been too slow to do that.

 

[bukIpower]

Seems to me we are reacting instead of dictating. The team that imposes their will usually wins and we've been too slow to do that.

Right on. We should know by now what teams are going to do to stop us so why not preemptively put in place the answer?

Like in the off season I hope we address our cold weather issues. The pressure issue needs fixed in the next 4 weeks though or it will be the off season Jan 1

 

[Taosman]

It seems the "issues" on offense are still not completely addressed. Urban probably knows this but the answer maybe some coach moving on.
One thing could be tried is go full power run game with Bowen(or a TE) helping out Prince and pound the rock and mix in the play-action pass.
Just fix the damn offense!

 

[RB07OSU]

I'm not an OL technique expert but when I watch prince, it's not like he's so slow he can't get his hands on a good pass rusher, he gets beat after contact (as it were). I'm hoping that's just a strength and technique issue. I also see him more than hold his own against a lot of guys. All in all, the kid is big as a house and athletic enough (I think) to play T at this level. Not sure why it isn't clicking but I feel like there is reason for optimism there.

On a side note, I feel awful for the kid. You see the look on his face sometimes and know he's just dying out there. It's not like he wants to go out there and fail in front of 100K people, I think he's taking one for the team by playing when he isn't quite ready yet. Pridgeon's injury contributed to this situation and the guys a year older that haven't stepped up should be the ones who feel the worst about watching a true sophomore having to get his teeth kicked in like this and the team suffer for it as well.

This 100%. I don't think we anticipated how big of a hit losing Pridgeon likely was. On that note, I wonder if Pridgeon is healthy and can shake off the rust to play in the playoffs? OL is a really tough spot to do a change-up late in the season but with how poorly Prince has been playing, it might be worth a shot if there is not some improvement in the bowl practices. Again, I think Prince will be fine in the long run but being in the playoffs, you fire every bullet you have and if Pridgeon is ready to play and is an improvement at that position, put him out there. I think Prince needs a ton of Coach Mick time and work on his technique in the off-season...we can work on technique in bowl practices but the strength gains won't come until after the season is over.

 

[ant80]

Everybody is talking about how Pridgeon might've been a better option, but he is a JUCO OL in his first year in the program. If we are talking about him starting, the OL would've still encountered some problems. The issue is Lisle seems to be a bust, as are Knox and Burrell (who are admittedly interior). That seems to be the likely explanation for this.

 

[Jaxbuck]

Everybody is talking about how Pridgeon might've been a better option, but he is a JUCO OL in his first year in the program. If we are talking about him starting, the OL would've still encountered some problems. The issue is Lisle seems to be a bust, as are Knox and Burrell (who are admittedly interior). That seems to be the likely explanation for this.

Lisle, Knox, Taylor and Trout are the OL names that are healthy and a year ahead of Prince (as you pointed out, not all are tackles).

Burrell is a year younger and has always been a guard to the best of my knowledge.

 

[Hstead]

I don't understand why they went away from giving him help like Bowen?
If I'm playing against this offense I bring the house until they beat my defense by hitting a big pass play.
Turnovers could well decide the Fiesta Bowl.

And when you see Bowen come in you drop 8 rush 3 and literally double every receiver. It's not that easy.

 

[Hstead]

Right on. We should know by now what teams are going to do to stop us so why not preemptively put in place the answer?

Like in the off season I hope we address our cold weather issues. The pressure issue needs fixed in the next 4 weeks though or it will be the off season Jan 1

I have heard and seen Urban talk a lot about how teams always show us something new or different. OSU is circled on every teams schedule. We game plan all week on what we expect and get in a game and see something different. So we don't always know what they are going to do to us.

 

[OregonBuckeye]

And when you see Bowen come in you drop 8 rush 3 and literally double every receiver. It's not that easy.

I doubt the coaches would be that predictable(I hope anyway) that every single time Bowen comes in they only pass.

 

[Hstead]

I doubt the coaches would be that predictable(I hope anyway) that every single time Bowen comes in they only pass.

Every defense has a coverage. You are taught to play "run first pass second" so with Bowen in you could bet the defense would have 7 in the box and most likely 8 so running would actually be more difficult too imho.

So if I'm coaching D against us, Bowen comes in I sub a bigger player in, 8 in the box, teaching run first, read pass drop 8.

We did something very similar vs scum when they had 3 tight ends in the game. We subbed Burger for Lattimore and put 8 in the box.

 

[Taosman]

My thinking is if we're a "run first " team anyway why not go Wisconsin style power and play action pass?
You simplify reads for JT and the WRers. You cut down on negative plays and turnovers. You control the clock.
You also keep Clemson offense off the field for longer periods helping your defense.
You basically play "Tressel ball".

 

[bukIpower]

I doubt the coaches would be that predictable(I hope anyway) that every single time Bowen comes in they only pass.

Then our receivers will have all day to get open because 6 vs 3 ain't a good look especially when all 6 are lineman... IMO it really is that easy. If our tight ends are going to stay in and block majority of the time then it really doesn't matter who's out there

 

[Poe McKnoe]

Interesting to look at the RT's we've started since Urban's been here 1 true OL until this year
12 - Fragle
13 - Decker
14 - Baldwin
15 - Farris
16 - Prince

first 3 did great... last two need some work

Should also mention here that 12, 13, and 14 had Warinner strictly at OL coach, on the field. 15 was a mix of OL/OC and field/booth. 16 there is a new OL coach.

 

[pnuts34]

This 100%. I don't think we anticipated how big of a hit losing Pridgeon likely was. On that note, I wonder if Pridgeon is healthy and can shake off the rust to play in the playoffs? OL is a really tough spot to do a change-up late in the season but with how poorly Prince has been playing, it might be worth a shot if there is not some improvement in the bowl practices. Again, I think Prince will be fine in the long run but being in the playoffs, you fire every bullet you have and if Pridgeon is ready to play and is an improvement at that position, put him out there. I think Prince needs a ton of Coach Mick time and work on his technique in the off-season...we can work on technique in bowl practices but the strength gains won't come until after the season is over.

I can't find the article, but Pridgeon is out for the entire year. Should be able to get reps in bowl practice, but not close to ready to play in a game. Urban stated this in an article that I read the other day, but can't remember from what site(I think Landof10)