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Should Urban redshirt so much?

With Thomas announcing he's leaving, the big question is whether not playing Bell (more) and Thomas (at all) in 2013 cost the team a title shot?

Thomas was an odd situation--how often do you see a guy play in one year, like he did in 2012, then redshirt the following year when that redshirt is not due to injury, and then play the following two years? The situation is even more odd when you consider how much of a non-factor he was in 2012 (the only thing I remember him doing at all was getting flagged for a personal foul or unsportsmanlike conduct--can't remember which--for a hit in the game in Madison) and how much of a star he had turned into when he surfaced in 2014.
 
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With Thomas announcing he's leaving, the big question is whether not playing Bell (more) and Thomas (at all) in 2013 cost the team a title shot?

Good point. Not sure about Thomas, but I think there's a strong case to be made that not playing Bell cost OSU the 2013 Big Ten title game, and thus, a shot at the national championship--in the first half when OSU got so far in a hole, it was largely due to atrocious secondary play.
 
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With Thomas announcing he's leaving, the big question is whether not playing Bell (more) and Thomas (at all) in 2013 cost the team a title shot?
It hampered a pretty flawed team from getting to the title game. That defense had so many issues and so many cooks in the kitchen. They also had a great athlete at QB who was bad at operating the option, bad at scrambling (not to be confused with his ability to sidestep defenders), no true h-backs to lean upon (their ONLY one was 170 lbs and not capable of staying on the field).

Might they have played for it all with a green and struggling true frosh Vonn Bell? People lose sight of the fact that he played other times that year, as well as the bowl game, and looked a lot like Corey. Now I agree that he should have played and grown, because Corey really struggled and Vonn's upside was high. Playing Vonn wasn't going to change CJ's play either, who never recovered from his injury against Miami years earlier.
 
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It hampered a pretty flawed team from getting to the title game. That defense had so many issues and so many cooks in the kitchen. They also had a great athlete at QB who was bad at operating the option, bad at scrambling (not to be confused with his ability to sidestep defenders), no true h-backs to lean upon (their ONLY one was 170 lbs and not capable of staying on the field).

Might they have played for it all with a green and struggling true frosh Vonn Bell? People lose sight of the fact that he played other times that year, as well as the bowl game, and looked a lot like Corey. Now I agree that he should have played and grown, because Corey really struggled and Vonn's upside was high. Playing Vonn wasn't going to change CJ's play either, who never recovered from his injury against Miami years earlier.

With Vonn, Clemson still carved up our secondary with ease and several episodes of miscommunication -- which seemed more of a over-complicated schematic issue than talent.
I imagine it wouldn't have been very pretty against FSU...
 
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I was glad not to repeat the UF championship game where UHM hand an under-prepared tOSU team its ass. That's what would've happened in 2013 and the ass whipping we took from Clemson proved it. I definitely think Vonn should've been playing most of the 2013 season, but I don't think it would been the dispositive difference. The 2014 team was different, a year early according to many, but they got it done.
 
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I was glad not to repeat the UF championship game where UHM hand an under-prepared tOSU team its ass. That's what would've happened in 2013 and the ass whipping we took from Clemson proved it. I definitely think Vonn should've been playing most of the 2013 season, but I don't think it would been the dispositive difference. The 2014 team was different, a year early according to many, but they got it done.
If we'd have played Bama I would agree but we would have played against ND had they won the BCG. We all know ND is not on par with tOSU.
 
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With Thomas announcing he's leaving, the big question is whether not playing Bell (more) and Thomas (at all) in 2013 cost the team a title shot?

Good question there. I think Bell was one of the biggest mistakes, as our secondary was struggling mightily all year (although he did not redshirt). Thomas might have very well helped as well. It is all conjecture but those two would have been a huge help. Also wonder on Mike Mitchell...he did not do much at TTech this year (not sure if he was injured or just didn't play much) but with how bad the defense was in 2013, I thought you had to at least try him.

But to the overall point of this thread, UFM has done an outstanding job in this category. And I think you will see way less redshirts next year with the departures and with the very talented class coming in. The "Who Will Redshirt" thread will be very interesting.
 
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EVALUATING OHIO STATE'S POTENTIAL CANDIDATES TO REDSHIRT AND PLAY AFTER NCAA RULE CHANGE

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Tracking how much true freshmen play throughout college football is going to be more interesting this upcoming season than it has ever been before.

That’s because of the rule change passed Wednesday by the NCAA, which will now allow football players to participate in up to four games in a season and still take a redshirt, as opposed to the previous rules under which playing in even one game would count as a season of competition.

Since his arrival at Ohio State in 2012, Urban Meyer has often said that he is not inclined to redshirt players. Though the numbers haven’t always backed those contentions up, they did last year, when the Buckeyes only redshirted six of their 20 true freshmen.

With the new redshirt rule in place, however, there’s reason for Meyer – and every coach in college football for that matter – to rethink the way they make redshirting decisions.

Now, coaches could potentially play freshmen in as many as four games before even making a decision on whether they should be redshirted, allowing teams to make fluid redshirting decisions as seasons unfold. Even players who coaches expect to redshirt all along are likely to see snaps in a few blowout games, as even a few snaps under their belt could be better than none as those players enter their redshirt freshman seasons.

On the other end of the equation, though, there could also be freshmen who end up seeing playing time in less games than they would have under the previous rules. Because while there will surely still be freshmen who earn regular playing time and play all year long as a result, coaches could become more inclined to limit freshmen with smaller roles to only four games in order to preserve their eligibility.

Some things won’t change. Meyer and his coaching staff are still going to expect players to earn their way onto the field, and there’s still only going to be a limited number of reps to go around, even in blowout games. So while the new rules gives coaches flexibility to play all of their players in as many as four games, it’s still likely that some freshmen will see less depending on their performance in practice and the depth/rotation at their respective positions.

At the same time, there will be freshmen who end up earning significant roles on offense, defense and especially on special teams, and those players still won’t redshirt, as they’ll be called upon to play in well over four games. And while the Buckeyes could choose to hold some of their freshmen out early in the season if they believe they can make an impact later in the season, with the possibility that they could see meaningful playing time and still have four remaining seasons of eligibility, there will also be players who prove to be too talented to redshirt at all.

Ultimately, though, it seems likely that the majority of Ohio State’s 25-man freshman class – and potentially even a few non-freshmen, too – will end up both playing and redshirting this season, as the Buckeyes will take advantage of the opportunity to get their feet wet without burning any of their eligibility.

We now take a look at who Ohio State’s most likely and less likely candidates are to redshirt this season, and evaluate how the Buckeyes might handle each of their playing time in light of the new rule.

LIKELY REDSHIRTS
MATTHEW BALDWIN, QB
Baldwin stands to be Ohio State’s biggest beneficiary of the redshirt rule change, and the same will likely to be true for freshman Buckeye quarterbacks in upcoming seasons. Every Ohio State quarterback to arrive in Columbus since Meyer became coach has redshirted their true freshman seasons, and that isn’t expected to change with Baldwin. What will change, though, is that the Buckeyes are likely to give him some opportunities to play at the end of lopsided games – now that they can do so without compromising his eligibility – in order to get him some live game action, which is as crucial for a quarterback as it is at any other position.

Baldwin is coming off of January knee surgery, and the Buckeyes won’t play him unnecessarily until he is completely healthy, which could make it more likely for Baldwin to see playing time near the end of the season. That could also be a good insurance plan for Ohio State, though, as the Buckeyes only have two other scholarship quarterbacks – Dwayne Haskins and Tate Martell – which means they could need Baldwin to play later in the season if injuries occur, yet could still redshirt him even if they need to call upon him in an emergency situation.

KAMRYN BABB, WR
CHRIS OLAVE, WR
L’CHRISTIAN “BLUE” SMITH, WR

Had the new redshirt rules been in place last year, Jaylen Harris would have received a redshirt after last season, as he ended up playing in only three games due to the veteran talent at wide receiver in front of him. Considering that all six of the wide receivers who played regularly for the Buckeyes last season are back on the roster this season, there isn’t likely to be any more playing time for the incoming crop of wideouts. That makes it very likely that Babb, Olave and Smith will all redshirt as true freshmen, but the Buckeyes should still take advantage of the new rule to get each of them on the field for a little bit of playing time.

MATTHEW JONES, C
MAX WRAY, OT

Even though Jones and Wray both arrived in January as early enrollees, neither player appears likely to the Buckeyes’ two-deep as true freshmen, making it likely that both offensive linemen will redshirt. Given that Ohio State typically only plays its first- and second-team offensive lines even in blowout games, it’s uncertain whether Jones and Wray will even see the field at all this season, but the new rules could potentially entice offensive line coach Greg Studrawa to play a little deeper into his depth chart in a couple lopsided games.

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Max Wray is a likely candidate to redshirt this season, but Ohio State could expand its offensive line rotation to get him on the field in a few games.

ALEX WILLIAMS, DE
JAVONTAE JEAN-BAPTISTE, DE/LB

While the Buckeyes are thin on veteran defensive end depth, Williams and Jean-Baptiste are both likely candidates to redshirt unless there are multiple injuries on the depth chart in front of them. Although defensive line coach Larry Johnson should find ways to get them on the field in a few games, as he likes to maintain a deep rotation at the defensive end position, both players are likely at least a year away from making significant impacts, so the Buckeyes will likely limit their game action to preserve their eligibility.

CAMERON BROWN, CB/WR
Although he could eventually end up on the offensive side of the ball for the Buckeyes, Brown is expected to begin his career as a cornerback due to Ohio State’s depth at wide receiver. Even so, Brown is likely a candidate to redshirt unless he earns a significant role on special teams or injuries strike at cornerback. By playing Brown in just a few games this year, the Buckeyes could get him a little experience but also preserve his eligibility as they figure out which position he can ultimately make the biggest impact at.

MARCUS HOOKER, S
Malik Hooker began his All-American career at Ohio State with a redshirt year, and it seems probable that his younger brother Marcus will do the same. While the Buckeyes have an open starting spot at safety, Marcus Hooker was the lowest-ranked recruit in Ohio State’s 2018 class, and could need some time to develop – like Malik did – before playing a big role at the collegiate level. Either way, though, Marcus should have the benefit that Malik did not of seeing at least some playing time as a true freshman – even if only a few snaps –since he can now do so without burning his redshirt.
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Entire article: https://www.elevenwarriors.com/ohio...s-to-redshirt-and-play-after-ncaa-rule-change

Re: MASTER TEAGUE III, RB
While the Buckeyes have an elite one-two punch at running back in J.K. Dobbins and Mike Weber, they don’t have any veteran depth at the position behind them, meaning the Buckeyes will likely need at least one of their true freshman running backs to play somewhat regularly, especially in games that become one-sided. The top candidate among them to play that role is Teague, who also among the early enrollee standouts this spring and should also be a prime candidate to earn a role this year on special teams.

and

JAELEN GILL, RB/H-BACK
BRIAN SNEAD, RB

While the Buckeyes will likely need at least one of their freshman running backs to play this season, they might not need two – or at least not two to both play more than four games. Gill and Snead should both see playing time as true freshmen, but with so much returning talent on Ohio State’s roster at running back and wide receiver – Gill, who could be the tougher choice to redshirt, could end up playing either at tailback or H-back – it could make sense for Ohio State to give them each touches in a few games but otherwise preserve their eligibility for the future.

Why not split the games played (i.e. 4 games each) for the three freshman running backs (i.e. Teague, Snead, and Gill) so all three get to redshirt and have that extra year.
 
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What will change, though, is that the Buckeyes are likely to give him some opportunities to play at the end of lopsided games – now that they can do so without compromising his eligibility – in order to get him some live game action, which is as crucial for a quarterback as it is at any other position.
Would we do that over Tate?
 
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OHIO STATE MUST BE CAREFUL NOT TO REDSHIRT TOO MANY PLAYERS UNDER NEW RULES

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Last week, the NCAA made a drastic change to its redshirt rules. In the past, if a player appeared on the field for even a single snap in one game, he lost an entire season of eligibility.

Under the new rules, however, a player can play in up to four games throughout the season and it would still be considered a redshirt year.

The rule change will certainly be a welcomed one for players and coaches as it allows for much more roster flexibility and the chance to get younger players on the field earlier with no consequence to their eligibility.

Another thing it's done is make redshirting a player much, much easier – and that's something Urban Meyer and Ohio State must be careful about, because as helpful as redshirts can be in certain situations, there are definitely downsides if they're used in excess, particularly at a school like Ohio State.

The first issue is that the best players at Ohio State rarely stay with the team for five years anyway, so redshirting them only wastes a season that they could have been on the field, even if it's just helping the team on special teams or getting playing time in garbage time at the end of games.

Guys like Eli Apple, Malik Hooker, Marshon Lattimore, Darron Lee and Gareon Conley all redshirted their freshman seasons, but did not use their full five seasons of eligibility. Thus, the redshirt year was effectively a waste of a season.

That's a problem, but it's not the largest problem caused by excessive redshirts because most of those players were buried on the roster anyway and it's not like the Buckeyes didn't have talent in front of them and desperately needed their contributions.

The larger issue is the players who redshirt and are never quite good enough to crack the starting lineup. That player then eats a scholarship for an extra season, which is a problem as Ohio State constantly deals with a numbers crunch of bringing in a full recruiting class every season while still managing to stay under the 85 scholarship limit.

That's an issue the Buckeyes have run into in the past, and have been trying to avoid ever since.

"Are they going to be here five years from now? Probably not," Urban Meyer said at a 2016 press conference when referring to a group of freshman that appeared in the season opener. "And if they are, they probably got bypassed."

Entire article: https://www.elevenwarriors.com/ohio...-to-redshirt-too-many-players-under-new-rules
 
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