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Toledo RB Ray Williams (official thread)

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Teenaged brains

Believe it or not there is actually a medical explanation for some of this behavior. The human brain, specifically the pre-frontal cortex, is not fully formed until the age 20-21. Kind of like wisdom teeth. The pre-frontal cortex is the area of the brain that allows us to anticipate future consequences and moderate our behavior accordingly. When one of our posters said that the kids only see the 'present' he was exactly right, scientifically. It's why teenaged boys who aren't famous athletes get in their names in the paper by wrecking their cars, killing themselves and friends.

They may look a lot like adults on the outside, except for the pimples, but they are not yet adults cerebrally. To compensate for this inherent brain deficit, parents, coaches and teachers need to lay down and enforce strict rules of behavior. But for many gifted teenaged athletes, there is no discipline at all. On the contrary, they are coddled and spoiled. Then, left to their own devices, teenaged boys find it diffcult to resist risky behavior.

Hope this doesn't sound like an excuse for the bad behavior we read about every day. It's not. It's merely a caution to the adults who care about these kids that they absolutely must lay down the law, because Junior's not able to lay it down for himself just yet.
 
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The pre-frontal cortex is the area of the brain that allows us to anticipate future consequences and moderate our behavior accordingly. When one of our posters said that the kids only see the 'present' he was exactly right, scientifically.
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:yow2: Wow, I think I'm smarter for having read that. I don't come to this board to get smarter. :wink2:

Just kidding... good first post.
 
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Mega


I am not smart enough to disagree with you but I would venture to say that there 80 or so other kids on the team whose pre-frontal cortex appears to be developed just fine. There are a lot of reasons young kids make mistakes. Let's just hope there are more reasons they choose not to make mistakes.
 
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Williams indicted on Murder charges

Two Benedictine High School football players were indicted on murder charges Wednesday, accused of causing the death of a schoolmate, 16-year-old Lorenzo Hunter.

The indictments for murder, aggravated robbery and robbery could send Raymond Williams, Ohio's reigning Mr. Football, and Bengals teammate Jon Huddleston to prison for 15 years to life if they are convicted.

The felony charges came amid new allegations related to a botched robbery attempt that resulted in Lorenzo's death early April 16.

Cuyahoga County Prosecutor Bill Mason said police are investigating whether Williams and Lorenzo were carrying real guns when they and Huddleston robbed Rodney Roberts and another man in a parked car near East 124th Street and Craven Avenue. Police do not believe Huddleston was carrying a gun.

Police and lawyers for the suspects originally said the guns were realistic-looking toys.

Mason said police also are pursuing reports that the three might have been involved in a separate attempted armed robbery earlier the night of April 15. Police said they are trying to find an East Cleveland man who may have been a victim in that incident, he said.

"This [new information] is causing us to look at these guys in a little different light," Mason said. "But nonetheless, it's still a tragedy."

The lawyer for Roberts, 20, the robbery victim who shot and killed Lorenzo, said police have a pellet gun brandished by Lorenzo that is virtually indistinguishable from a genuine 9 mm pistol.

Police have been unable to find a gun that Williams admitted carrying to determine if it was real or fake, he said.

The grand jury also heard evidence against Roberts, but declined to indict him on murder charges - concluding that Roberts acted in self-defense when he shot and killed Lorenzo. But the grand jury issued an indictment against him for carrying a concealed weapon.

Whether the guns were real would not change the charges against Williams and Huddleston, Mason said. Although neither pulled the trigger, under state law they could be found responsible for Lorenzo's death if it is determined they took part in the crimes that led to the shooting.

Williams and Huddleston, both 18, are free on $100,000 bond each.

Attorney Fernando Mack, who represents Williams, said he has heard talk of real guns and a second attempted robbery, but he has discounted those reports.

"They have not presented any evidence that Ray Williams was involved in anything of that nature," Mack said. "As far as we're concerned, it's just conjecture designed to bolster the prosecution's cases."

Mack said he had hoped that Roberts would be indicted on a murder charge and that Williams and Huddleston would have been absolved of causing Lorenzo's death.

"Had [Roberts] complied with these young men's demands, we can assume that Mr. Hunter would not be dead today," Mack said.

Roberts' lawyer, Charles Swanson, said the decision not to indict his client on a murder charge was fair. Swanson disputed reports from Benedictine that the teens - teammates on the school's state-champion football team last year - were basically good kids caught in a bad situation.

None of the men had an adult criminal record.
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"Had [Roberts] complied with these young men's demands, we can assume that Mr. Hunter would not be dead today," Mack said.
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This Mack guy has got to be a candidate for jackass of the month for that comment. Oh yeah, if Roberts just would have listened to the guys pointing guns at him like a good citizen, blah, blah, blah.
 
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"Had [Roberts] complied with these young men's demands, we can assume that Mr. Hunter would not be dead today," Mack said.
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Mr. Mack should be disclipined by the bar for that statement - absolutely unbelieveable, a new low for the legal profession, advocating that the public assume the position of victimhood with respect to criminal behaivor. If the criminals get their way, then no one gets hurt, I guess....
 
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WTF is going on in Ohio's legal system?

Wednesday, police Cmdr. Ed Tomba said the murder charges are warranted even though neither Huddleston nor Williams fired the fatal shots. Under state law, they are responsible for Lorenzo's death because they evidently took willful part in criminal conduct that led to it, Tomba said.

Say what? So if I'm a high school kid toilet-papering some guy's house and the guy comes out and shoots my friend who was helping me, I'm the one guilty of killing my friend? No wonder we have all these criminals on the street instead of in jail.

"Had [Roberts] complied with these young men's demands, we can assume that Mr. Hunter would not be dead today," Mack said.

Just another example of how true criminals are treated as innocent and the innocent are the criminals...
 
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Shooter of Lorenzo Hunter gets probation

http://www.cleveland.com/news/plaindealer/index.ssf?/base/cuyahoga/1091093583297493.xml

Cleveland man gets probation in Benedictine player's death
Thursday, July 29, 2004
Jim Nichols
Plain Dealer Reporter
The man who shot and killed one of three Benedictine High School football players accused of trying to rob him got probation Wednesday on the only charge he faced, carrying a concealed weapon.

Rodney Roberts' sentence sent the dead boy's mom into a sobbing fit, but Roberts, 20, had no police record and was not indicted for the April 16 shooting because a grand jury ruled it self-defense.

"There's no justice - that's all I have to say," said Cheryl Tucker, mother of the dead 16-year-old, Lorenzo Hunter, after she stormed out of court.

Police and prosecutors say Lorenzo and two football-star friends, including Ohio's Mr. Football, Raymond Williams, pointed one or more real-looking but replica guns at Roberts and another man, then demanded money. Roberts, of Cleveland, drew a gun and shot Lorenzo, police said. The shooting happened near East 124th Street and Craven Avenue, in the pre-dawn hours of a day during Benedictine's spring break.

Cuyahoga County Common Pleas Judge Eileen Gallagher told Roberts she was sorry that because of the "horrible thing that happened . . . four men's lives were changed forever."

"Whatever they were up to that night, God only knows," Gallagher said.

"But one of them is dead and two are going to spend an awful long time in prison."

Williams and Jon Huddleston, 19-year-old teammates with Lorenzo on the state-champion Bengals team, have pleaded not guilty to charges of murder and aggravated robbery for their part in the circumstances that led to Lorenzo's death.

%%bodybegin%% In April, Huddleston's lawyer said his client would throw himself on the mercy of the court. Williams' attorney said such a tactic would be premature for his client, saying the tragic robbery was "just a joke that had snowballed."

Gallagher found Roberts guilty of the weapons charge after he pleaded no contest on June 29. Roberts said little to Gallagher Wednesday, except to offer what the judge rejected as excuses when she chastised him for not holding a job in two years. She told him to find one, and said he would go to prison for 18 months if he tested positive for drugs or otherwise violated his probation.

Before the judge rendered her sentence, Assistant County Prosecutor Thomas Cahill asked Gallagher if Lorenzo's family members could speak. Gallagher declined the request, saying they were not victims of the concealed-carry charge Roberts was convicted of.

Then Tucker, Lorenzo's mother, stormed out, wailing. Afterward, she said little. But Eric Johnson, who said he was Lorenzo's youth-football coach and a family friend, said Gallagher's denial was "a crushing blow." He then read from a statement.

Only Lorenzo knew why he was there that night, said Johnson, who called the teen "an exceptional young man" and an exemplary scholar-athlete who "could be counted on to motivate his peers to do good works."

"His death left a huge void not just in his family, but in the community," Johnson said. "I can tell you he had no desire to participate in that activity."
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I actually consider myself to somewhat intelligent on the substantive criminal law in Ohio. This case is not even somewhat analogous to toiletpapering. Whether the gun used in the robbery was real or not, it is aggravated robbery as long as it was reasonable to believe it was a real gun (remember it was dark outside). Whether the gun was real or not, Hunter's death was in self-defense as long as it was reasonable to believe the gun was real and as long as the shooter felt threatened at the time he defended himself.

In Ohio, if you commit a dangerous felony such as aggravated robbery, you are responsible for the foreseeable consequences flowing from the felony. Here, it was foreseeable that a man would believe the gun used in the robbery to be real, and feel as though he had to defend himself by deadly force. In Ohio, it also does not matter that the individual killed is a co-conspirator. The other co-conspirators will be responsible for his death as long as it was a foreseeable consequence of the commission of a dangerous felony, and the death resulted during the commission of that felony.

As long as Hunter wasn't shot in the back fleeing the scene, it's a slam dunk for the prosecution.
 
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The human brain, specifically the pre-frontal cortex, is not fully formed until the age 20-21. Kind of like wisdom teeth. The pre-frontal cortex is the area of the brain that allows us to anticipate future consequences and moderate our behavior accordingly. When one of our posters said that the kids only see the 'present' he was exactly right, scientifically. It's why teenaged boys who aren't famous athletes get in their names in the paper by wrecking their cars, killing themselves and friends.
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This should be mandatory reading for everyone who wants to post on the recruiting board. It does not say kids shouldn't be held accountable, but it does say that we need to understand how their minds work before making judgements about how they make judgements.

Maybe JT understands this better than we do and considers it in whether he wants to take a gamble on a particular kid. Maybe that prototypical 'JT Recruit' is simply the kid who is ahaed of the curve with his prefontal cortex. Maybe Louis Irizarry and Maurice Clarett don't have a prefontal cortex.

How many times do we utter the phrase "what a waste of talent"? The bad news is that all the kids who are candidates to make the same mistakes Ray Williams made either don't read the paper or couldn't relate the events to themselves if they did.
 
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