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Unborn victims bill

Discussion in 'Open Discussion (Work-safe)' started by ashlandbuck, Mar 25, 2004.

  1. ashlandbuck

    ashlandbuck Banned

    This bill passed making it a crime to kill or cause injury to an unborn child.
    Ok, I'm confused. It's legal to kill the child with an abortion but illegal to kill the child through any other means?
  2. Nixon

    Nixon Wears Scarlet-colored glasses

    It's OK if the mother wants to kill the baby, but not ok if someone else kills the baby.

    Yeah. Right.
  3. ashlandbuck

    ashlandbuck Banned

    Ah yes, it's the womans right to choose....Unless of course it's another woman making the choice for her.

    This is unbelievable stuff here.
  4. buckeyebri

    buckeyebri 40 Days in the Hole

    GW under center...he takes the snap...rolls to his left...lines up his congressional blockers....

    Holy cow it looks like the start of an end run around the Supreme Court.....
  5. Oh8ch

    Oh8ch Cognoscente of Omphaloskepsis Staff Member

    You got it Bri - this is the first step in an end run on Roe v. Wade.

    I have always found it fascinating that men are so comfortable discussing abortion in the abstract.

    Has anyone REALLY considered what it would be like to find out after a night of drunken revelry that there was a baby growing in your tummy? To find that many of your future plans were in jeopardy because your method of birth control didn't work as promised. To face what for any woman is an incredibly difficult choice. But wait, it is not your choice after all. You first must send an email to one of the conservative memebers of Buckeye Planet and get their permission to terminate an unplanned and unwanted pregnancy.

    I don't like the idea of abortion. I can't imagine having one if I were a woman and I can't imagine advising my daughter to have one. Nor can I imagine why the decision should be mine because I am able to construct some intellectual argument as to why terminating a fetus is murder. No matter how strong my opposition may be it simply is not my call.

    Life is a prescious thing. A life lived in freedom is even more prescious. Part of that freedom for a woman is the right to choose to give birth. In a world where birth control is available, but sometimes fails - in a world where drugs, alcohol, and immaturity often impair the judement of young women - the argument that the choice occurs when one consents to have intercourse simply doesn't hold up.
  6. Woody1968

    Woody1968 Agent Provocateur

    It takes two to make a baby. Saying that you don't have the right to have a say, because you are a man is just avoiding the issue.
  7. Oh8ch

    Oh8ch Cognoscente of Omphaloskepsis Staff Member

    If you are talking about the biological father I agree. I am talking about men (and women if you wish) who are discussin other people's abortions in the abstract.
  8. Nixon

    Nixon Wears Scarlet-colored glasses

    You find it fascinating that men don't think about what it would be like to be a preganant woman.

    I find it fascinating that people don't think about what it would be like to have your brain sucked out with a vacuum cleaner or to be burned/drowned to death by saltwater.
  9. ashlandbuck

    ashlandbuck Banned

    Uh, buckeyebri, the only part GW has in this bill is the signing of it.
    Once authored, he supported it and agreed to sign it if it came before him.


    Because of poor judgement you then believe it is ok to have an obortion.
    This is disgusting and it is why I am so against it. To you and many others it is a matter of inconvenience. If someone makes a poor choice on a night out drinking then kill the fetus. She doesn't want the hassle anyways, right?
    I'm sorry but this is despicable and the epitome of selfishness.
  10. What about when the condomn breaks?

    What if a woman who takes her BC pills and forgets and during the first month of pregnancy she has been drinking/smoking/ect.?

    Our planet is already overpopulated, with millions living in poverty and struggling to stay alive. The human race is devouring this planets natural resources, which is why I'm okay with abortion.
  11. ashlandbuck

    ashlandbuck Banned

    The final solution
  12. I think if it was easier to get the day after pill, this would cut the number of abortions down.

    On the other hand is there human nutering(spelling), I saw a Seinfeld episode on it, always wondered if it was legit.
  13. KillerNut

    KillerNut Banned

    I know it is a joke to most, but if you are not ready for the comitment, and the concequences then you shouldn't do the act.

    Women have to be smarter, and Men have to be more responsible.

    But what did the child do to deserve death?

    I couldn't feed my 8 month old child, or he/she is inconvienent, or wasn't part of my planys so I killed it? Does that sound alright? Not to me.

    I am sorry if it upsets anyone but I see no difference, and I mean absolutely none, between that and abortion.

    I don't support any human taking any other humans life no matter what the reason is.

    It is why I couldn't have been a solider. It is why I am against capital punishment. And why I am against abortion. Only one of the people that do these things I hold in high reguard, guess which one.
  14. jlb1705

    jlb1705 hipster doofus Bookie

    Here is the reason why abortion will always be legal, regardless of morality:

    Any piece of legislation that bans abortion will have to include exceptions for incest, rape, and health of the mother. Imagine that such legislation goes into effect.

    The same type of doctors that prescribe oxycontins to all the strung-out hillbillies in my neighborhood would be performing secret abortions or making fraudulent diagnoses of endangerment to the mother. Also, there would be a deluge of false rape accusations by mothers who don't want their babies. This would be grossly unfair to the falsely accused, and it would clog up the justice system. When you add on top of that the fact that pregnancy by its very nature limits the time frame in which such accusations could be investigated and prosecuted, and it just becomes impossible to sort out everything before the nine months is up.
  15. Oh8ch

    Oh8ch Cognoscente of Omphaloskepsis Staff Member

    OK "Killer" :)

    Ashland - I never said a word about "convenience". Nor did I refer to 'poor' judgement. Impaired judgement is a very different thing.

    Let's put a little perspective on this. "Abortion" has been around forever and has been practiced by virtually every species. It is only recently that humans were able to go in and get the fetus prior to birth. Other species (and formerly humans as well) had to wait until the 'child' emerged on its own before killing it.

    Some species eat their young. Others kick them from the litter to starve. Humans might have bashed a head against a tree or simply left an infant lying on the ground and gone about their business. I am not talking ancient history. Until recently (and probably still on a lesser scale) there were cultures that would kill unwanted female children.

    The reason across all of these species was and is the same. Not convenience, but survival. Trying to nurture the one could put the entire group at risk. Only in the past few centuries have humans been held accountable for killing their own off spring.

    But in today's modern society this is clearly taboo. We have forbidden killing the child, and many would forbid killing the fetus, but we have not solved the underlying problem of "survival".

    This is an incredibly emotional issue (I can't believe I was foolish enough to dive in). Some folks have an image of the typical abortion client as a young women partying with abandon and having one abortion after another becuase it suits them.

    What about the 15 year old girl from the inner city who has an opportuinty to become the first in three generations to graduate from HS. The kid who has never known her father and received no guidance from a crack-head mother. The kid who was an easy mark for a smooth talker and thought she was safe because she listened to the birth control myths of her equally uneducated frineds. The kid who is completely unprepared to become a parent in every respect. The kid who now, without a HS degree and with child in tow, is destined to repeat the cycle. The kid whose 'survival' (in the sense that they would have a chance to lead a 'free' and fullfilling life- likely nurturing other children in the process) is at risk.

    Is that they typical abortion profile? Hell, I don't know - and I don't think anyone else on here does either. And for most anti-abortionist is doesn't matter. A fetus is a life and is sacred. Never mind that the same evolution in morals that has made a simple solution to an age old problem immoral has not solved the underlying problem itself.

    Clealry I am not proposing we return to an age of abandoning unwanted children to die - and I have already stated my personal distaste for the abortion process. But what offends the sensibilities of so many of us is a life changing decision for others. Whether a fetus is a human life is a hotly debated topic. My take on that issue is mine and yours is yours. The question is not what each of us believes, but our right to impose that belief on others.

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