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*Warning - optimistic post* - compare to 2001, NC in 2005??? (Long)

Discussion in 'Buckeye Football' started by MistriBuck, Oct 20, 2004.

  1. MistriBuck

    MistriBuck aka MartyrBuck

    compare to 2001, NC in 2005??? (more reason to believe)

    This whole thought started because I was thinking about how Snyder has left a lot to be desired and garnered a lot of i compared the 2001 defense to this years.....D'Antonio wasn't setting the world on fire in 2001 and neither was that defensive unit.........i found that the similarities are incredibly striking, atleast in my humble opinion.......maybe Snyder needs a year to work with these guys and grow in his role, much like D'Antonio?........check out the similarities of we have now, compared to what we had then, as well as what we had come back for 2002 compared to what we should have back next year.........i'll point out some offensive similarities, as well as overall performance.......the only glaring difference would be Nugent being gone, but maybe his predecessor will work hard to fill that void and surprise us?


    what i feel to be striking similarities between this year's and that year's defenses:

    Young, talented, developing defensive line: 3 sophomore starters with playmaking ability, and a senior that had no real consistency and sometimes was pretty disappointing......the bonus here? we have more quality depth NOW....although no superstar like Smith, I expect the unit to be comparable to 2004 as a whole

    Linebackers: Wilhelm in his jr. year/Hawk in his jr. year, Hawk is better.........Cooper and Carpenter are extremely comparable, Carpenter will be better in '05 than Grant in '02.......Bullard/D'Andrea/Schlegal - definite ability but impact player? Dare i say D'Andrea/Schlegal MUCH better than Reynolds in 02?.............looking good here!

    CB's - Derek Ross/Fox - solid upperclassmen, although Ross made more game changing plays, Fox is just as good in his own right...........Cie Grant/Underwood/Youboty - YIKES!!! <!--EZCODE EMOTICON START :\ -->[​IMG]<!--EZCODE EMOTICON END--> , maybe one of the current guys steps up to fill a gamble type roll in '05, or one of the young studs (Ginn maybe, O'Neil even?).....won't be too hard to have someone fill the same shoes as Fox did in '02........possible bonus here too: MUCH more depth and competition

    Safeties/Nickel: Fox&Allen were Nickel guys/Tyler Everett/Youboty - solid nickel guys still developing, plenty of potential.........Salley/Nickey - Jrs., solid, but have been the goat, Salley has potential to be a LOT better than Nickey..........Whitner/Doss - hmmmm? Whitner just might be the next Doss, just a year behind...........again we have plenty of Depth and comp here, who pushed Doss and Nickey and Allen in '02?

    pretty amazingly similar if you ask me, even more so than I originally thought when I thought up this idea


    about the offense.......not quite as similar, but defenses win championships anyway, especially with Tresselball!...but you know what? it may be even more promising

    O-Line - very young in '01 with Olivea, Step, Bishop, Clarke........this year's guys are definitely young, and probably not as talented, but they'll be back, a year older, with no shortage of competition, 2 will be Srs. next year, one migh los his job!......some of these younger guys may just step up and dominate next year (yes this is assuming we can get the most out of them, how great would THAT be?)

    QB - can't really compare Zwick or Smith to Bellisari, but consider this........what if Krenzel in his RS Soph. year was the full-time starter? would we have gone through the same pains? possibly? probably? yr. (whoever emerges as the starter) will be a RS Jr. like Krenzel was, with a year starting under their belt, if someone could just step up (or be given the chance to step up) and produce atleast as much as he did

    RB - Ross/Wells.......departing seniors, Wells produced of course, and Ross isn't, but look at next year and compare......2 freshman coming back that seem to have some nice potential, and hey we're in on some bigtime RB's, could Stewart have the impact that Mo had? can we land him? we can dream right? FB Martin was in a class of his own and was probably 30% responsible for the successful rushing attack that year, our FB situation next year CAN'T be worse than it was in '02 with Schnittker, White, and Johnson

    WR - one playmaker/go-to guy Jenkins/Holmes in their So. yr.........01 had another strong option with Vance, no Vance this year.....but looking at next yr. expecting Holmes back can, he can be just as deadly as Jenkins, I can't imagine Hall or another young guy not producing atleast as much as Gamble in '02........bonus here??? you bet!!! NO DEPTH in '02, we'll have Hall, Lyons, Dukes, Ginn(?), Gonzalez, Jordan fighting it out, someone will have to step it up, and the depth should be stellar

    TE - Sanders/Hamby, very comparable........but we'll have Hamby back for his Sr. yr., Hartsock was in his Jr. yr. in 02, maybe a Sr. Hamby is better than a Jr. Hartsock?.......there was absolutely no #2 TE threat in 02, Hamby was a frosh in there almost full-time!.......another bonus!! have to believe Nicol as a Soph. will be better and provide a viable option


    In conclusion, i'm actually really glad I decided to put this together..........when you really think about this, it's my opinion that '05 looks even MORE PROMISING than '02......the similarities are are eery and as I pointed out the depth and returning players could/should be better..........also if you think about it and compare '01 to this year, doesn't this team appear to be WORSE in many areas????? especially the offense: in '01 we had a productive RB, a super FB, 2 viable options at WR, a Sr. QB who produced a lot more than Zwick is so far, and the o-line was MUCH why would we EXPECT much different than '01? There were horrid and disappointing outings in '01 too - UCLA!! Illinois, PSU, Wisconsin........hell we even had less than impressive games against Akron, Indiana, SDSU.......we weren't embarrased like we were against IOWA, but how bout those comebacks we allowed, were they any better??? and guess what? WE BEAT MICHIGAN!!! at the big house nonetheless!!

    to have a similar season in '05 it will come down to 4 things
    1.) QB play - can they produce at atleast the level of Krenzel?
    2.) RB's - can anyone step up or burst on the scene like Reecie?.......if you think about it, he was missing for a lot of the year, and we had to win the tough ones without him anyway.......what games was he the REAL DIFFERENCE IN? WAZZU/MICHIGAN, and MIAMI b/c of that one play but not from a rshing production standpoint
    3.) Leaders - will leaders emerge like in '02? I think Doss and Wilhelm's leadership can't be measured
    4.) Special Teams - hard to replace Nugent and Groom

    You know what??? Things look VERY BRIGHT IN MY EYES.....and I HONESTLY wasn't sure I could find anything bright or positive to pull out of this current MESS, I wasn't even trying to do so but it kind of evolved into that

    Obviously things still need to change, and changes on the offensive side on the ball would be like a gift from heaven, but even if they don't, I feel there is no reason not to believe we can make another run in '05 JUST LIKE '02

    Wow that was long, if you lasted this long, thanks for reading and hope you enjoyed it
    Last edited: Feb 4, 2005
  2. BuckNutty

    BuckNutty Hear The Drummer Get Wicked Staff Member Bookie

    Good stuff, Mistri.

    Now do me a favor and put up your Tool Avatar. :wink2:
  3. OilerBuck

    OilerBuck Sweet Crude

    Dang're a Rage AND a Tool fan?

    I can tell we'd get along just fine. Sorry...I have a tendency to hijack threads. An analysis on the first post will come when I get the time and patience to read it.
  4. BIATCHabutuka

    BIATCHabutuka out of chaos comes playoffs

    good post, you got me salivating for 2005 until i read your list of four keys for the year.

    1. we need zwick/smith/boeckman/whoever to play like an all time great craig krenzel. certainly possible but not likely statistically.

    2. we need pittman, haw, or recruit to play like maurice, another all time great. certainly possible but not likely statistically.

    3. leadership like doss and wilhelm. doss and wilhelm were great leaders but i think we will be ok here. lots of guys who remember the winning and have experienced losing in 04. you gotta think some great leaders will emerge from the linebackers / wide outs / and ideally qbs if not elsewhere.

    4. replace nugent and groom. next to impossible but perhaps we could still dominate on special teams in the other facets, returning kicks, covering kicks, and blocking kicks. very possible in the other ways but extremely unlikely in the nugent, groom, andrews department.

    i know all four of the keys (which i agree with by the way) may seem unlikely but none are totally out of the realm of being a strength of the team. we got a chance but with michigan and pennstate on the road it is by definition our hard year on the sked. probably poised for a big thing in 06 though if we can reload on D after 05. funny thing though, everyone thought that we were primed for a NC run in 03 not 02 with that team and we made it happen. no reason we can't in 05.
  5. souL

    souL I.bulldoze

    Well, I think this post goes to show that regardless of what goes on here in '04, that '05 is a new season. We've got the talent--and we've got a coach that's proven his system works (let's not forget his days at YSU).
  6. kn1f3party

    kn1f3party Junior

    Excellent points. I continue to get excited when I think of how many starters we'll return next year. It isn't just the number of players that should come back, but their potential. Poor Longhorns, they'll find out the hard way.
  7. Sdgobucks

    Sdgobucks Pig on a wing

    Two more keys to 2005.

    1. O-line production.

    2. Bollman is unemployed.

    I know they both will work hand in hand, but they are very important.
  8. kn1f3party

    kn1f3party Junior

    Usually you worry about bringing in a new coach for a problem area. It could cause a stutter before there is improvement. At this point I think that's impossible. The day Bollman cleans his office there will be a sigh of relief in Buckeye country.
  9. MistriBuck

    MistriBuck aka MartyrBuck

    ahhhhh will do BuckNutty, you're one of the few that recognizes it as TooL :cool:

    on my way to bed, will do tomorrow and also respond to your guys' responses........appreciate the positive feedback
  10. Def

    Def Newbie

    In 2005 OSU has a favorable schedule. No Prudue or Wisconsin. Only 4 games on the road. PSU, Indiana, Minny, and scUM.
  11. yt6

    yt6 Newbie

    HOw much has our defense suffered by losing our D coordinator? Or is it just loss of talent that has made such a big difference this year?
  12. tundra1

    tundra1 Junior

    I would add a fifth key--playing well enough on the road. We all remember the close games in 2002 playing at Purdue, Cincinnati, Northwestern, Wisconsin, and Illinois. Never mind the Fiesta Bowl.

    In 2005, we have to play up north. If we show the mental toughness of the 2002 team, we have a chance. If we play any games next year with the same intensity of last week's Iowa game...
  13. IronBuckI

    IronBuckI Calmer than you are.

    10 of 11 starters from the 2002 season were drafted, over the last two years. The only one left broke his arm, and has been out for half the season. I would say that a loss of talent, but most importantly experience, has contributed to our defensive vulnerabilities this year.
  14. MistriBuck

    MistriBuck aka MartyrBuck

    I wanted to further point out the INCREDIBLE similarities between the '01 and '04 defenses, and also offer up reasons to be even more excited about '05 than '02 on this side of the ball:

    Speaking of EERILY similar statistics you ready for the comparison between 2001 and 2004 defense? About the D-line aren't they the biggest factor in stopping the run? Look at the rushing yardage, you CAN'T tell me the D-line in '01 was better than '04........looking at sacks and TFL there is a bit of a difference there although not huge, and i'd say the linebackers on this year's team make up for the difference, and could make up the difference in '05 to make next year's D comparable to ' further comparing D'Antonio and Snyder in their first year we're all complaining about soft zones and coverage..........we're giving up significantly LESS yards per pass attempt this year

    obviously all of this is based on only half of a year but here we go:

    Overall YPG
    2001: 335.8
    2004: 336.0

    Rush YPG / Per attempt
    2001: 138.8 / 3.6
    2004: 141.7 / 3.7

    Pass YPG / Per attempt
    2001: 197 / 6.5
    2004: 195 / 5.8

    2001: 28 Total in 12 games, 17 by D-line, 14 by underclassmen (returning)............that's 1 sack every 25.9 pass attempts by players that came back in '02
    2004: 10 Total in 6 games, 7 by D-line, 6 by underclassmen.....that's 1 sack every 33.8 by players coming back

    there is a deficiency in this area......but i'm willing to say this can EASILY be attributed to the schemes used against us quick screens, rollouts, etc., which also explains the less Pass YPA

    TFL - front 7 only to compare the DL and LB units and the point that the LB's are/will make up for any difference
    2001: 69 Total in 12 games, 45 from D-line, 36 of them from underclassmen, 24 from LB's, only 10 from underclasssmen........that's 1 TFL every 25.9 attempts from returning D-linemen, overall 1 TFL every 6.72 rushing attempts from front 7, 1 TFL every 10.08 from returning players
    2004: 31 Total in 6 games, 17.5 from D-line, 15 from underclassmen, 13.5 from LB's, all underclassmen......that's 1 TFL every 33.8 attemps from returning D-linemen, overall 1 TFL every 7.39 rush attemps (another striking similarity), 1 TFL every 8.04 from returning players

    i think the key ingredient in looking at the front 7 is if you notice how comparable the defense in 01 and 04 are, then you look at what's returning in our front 7 for '05, MUCH MORE than what was returning in '02...........check it '02 we had returning 70% of our sack and TFL production from the front '05 that figure is 91%.........and the db situation is nearly the same, 1 Sr. cb leaving........and i don't think you can underestimate the importance of all the young talent that will push the starters

    can we start getting excited about next year's defense now? :biggrin:
  15. Buckeye737

    Buckeye737 Sophmore

    Hopefully we can get a running back to come in like Clarett. Come on JStew.

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