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[strike]Litl[/strike] Planet Earth, whereas I can't be certain of this, I think you have the wrong idea of a matchup zone in your head - think man-to-man with a lot of switching.

One benefit of running this type of "zone" defense is that it clarifies the switching schemes, off-ball defensive matchups and creates better help defense. The most noted weakness is rebounding, but this is an execution issue.

There is generally only one "slide" that pulls the bigs out of the paint and that's when there is a quick ball rotation to the opposite corner. This is usually because the ball has been either passed or driven in a way to cause the backside guard to rotate strong side and the backside wing to rotate up. In this slide (which Koufos really struggled to execute, Dallas does a good job and BJ is somewhere in the middle) strong side quickly becomes weak side, but, if there is a shot, the weak side should already be "overloaded" because of the quick ball rotation. In theory, the weakside wing and guard should already be in position and the strongside guard, who has rotated weak, should be matched as well. This may present a matchup problem somewhere in the paint of big offensive rebounder versus smaller defensive rebounder, but thats a sacrifice you make in order to "force" the shot from the corner - generally a much lower percentage shot. Point is, you should have at least two wing players and one guard in or near the paint to rebound. When those players are Lighty or Turner you see some good "covering down" and their athleticism makes up for matchup issues.

Some of our wings and guards struggle with their cover downs and/or other slides in the helpside. Here's the thing though, if they can't execute relatively short 6-8 foot defensive slides in the helpside in a scheme where they are already in position to make the slide, how can you depend on these kids to play good helpside in a man where they could be anywhere on the court? How can they be sure of their switching "dos and donts" when they are constantly in different situations? Matchup zone reduces variables and shortens help assignments.

By the way, the Bucks are a solid defensive team. I honestly don't know why there is so much noise about switching schemes in the first place.
 
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Some people have been complaining about the zone for years, even though we've been among the leaders in ppg defense. I saw people griping about the zone when we lost 55-50, as if allowing 55 points was the problem.

ppg defense:

2007 - 62.0
2008 - 62.2
2009 - 61.8

The national median is just under 70.

We virtually have a 7 man rotation at this point. We have guys playing 35+ minutes a night. Man defense would tire them faster and increase the chances for foul trouble. I would love to go 10 deep and play press man all over the court, but our roster isn't deep enough to do it.
 
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[quote='BusNative;141253;7]Litl, whereas I can't be certain of this, I think you have the wrong idea of a matchup zone in your head - think man-to-man with a lot of switching.
.[/quote]
I have two problems with the matchup zone. One is rebounding and the other one is that there seems to be a lack of communication between the guys playing the zone which leads to quite a few wide-open shots. I am not saying that they should play man-to-man all the time but it might be a nice changeup just as switching defenses in any sport. I guess I would just like one person to tell me which college program plays zone defense for all 40 minutes. Even Syracuse does not do that any longer.
 
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BuckeyeTillIDie;1412603; said:
Here you go:

OSU PPG: 67.8
OSU FGP%: .483%
OSU 3PT: 155/418 -- .371%
OSU RBs: 34/game

I've always hated the way they record rebounds - total rebounds can be misleading. I wish they would track two stats, offensive rebounding % and defensive rebounding percentage. If a team is over 70% on defensive rebounds, they're OK on that end. tOSU isn't close to 70% this year.
 
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dislaimer: i haven't read any posts


i want to know why we didn't go to the box and 1 (i think that's what its called) with diebler locking down that kid who was unconcious.

also, how do you get caught asleep in no man's land in the zone on the last play of the game?
 
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Jake;1412546; said:
Some people have been complaining about the zone for years, even though we've been among the leaders in ppg defense. I saw people griping about the zone when we lost 55-50, as if allowing 55 points was the problem.

ppg defense:

2007 - 62.0
2008 - 62.2
2009 - 61.8

The national median is just under 70.

you have to take possessions per game into account i believe
 
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I guess in my head this is simple to me and others (litl :biggrin:) don't see it that way...It is a situation where some agree to disagree...It is all about scheme, what you think works and doesn't work...

Rebounding is about positioning and getting yourself there where you feel the ball might come off the rim...Having the knack to follow the ball thru the air and know where it is going to come off the rim, that is why at times the shooter can be the best rebounder because he knows where his miss is going to go...

But it is not always about the biggest guy, but just the one that understands positioning...Take Dennis Rodman for example, all he was a rebounder not a real big guy, but just had the knack to get to the ball...

It does not matter whether it is zone or man...GUys that gets lots of rebounds, go to a position on the floor...If Rodman's guy is taking the three pointer, or he is defending a guy on the 3 point line, obviously he isn't boxing his guy out at the three point line, he is crashing to the paint to where he is thinking the ball is goig, using great body control and grabbing the ball...

But this is a whole nother discussion that many have always thought that rebounding out of a zone is much more difficult...Do you think if MSU played zone they would not be able to rebound out of it? Do you think if you put Rodman in a zone he would have a harder time getting rebounding numbers...The reason is because guys allow the offensive team to get in closer to the rim, but good rebounder can rebound, even if htey are not the inside guy as the get the position to where the ball where come and don't allow the inside guy to back up to get the ball...

It comes down to our team not understanding positioning very well...Offensively or defensively, and the coach can only tell you so many times where to be...At some point it is the players job to realize this and do things for themselves...
 
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crazybuckfan40;1412617; said:
It comes down to our team not understanding positioning very well...Offensively or defensively, and the coach can only tell you so many times where to be...At some point it is the players job to realize this and do things for themselves...

illustrated on the play late in the game when the 3 pt shooter last night missed the 3 and got his own rebound on the other side of the court!
 
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[quote='BusNative;141253;7][strike]Litl[/strike] Planet Earth, whereas I can't be certain of this, I think you have the wrong idea of a matchup zone in your head - think man-to-man with a lot of switching.

One benefit of running this type of "zone" defense is that it clarifies the switching schemes, off-ball defensive matchups and creates better help defense. The most noted weakness is rebounding, but this is an execution issue.

There is generally only one "slide" that pulls the bigs out of the paint and that's when there is a quick ball rotation to the opposite corner. This is usually because the ball has been either passed or driven in a way to cause the backside guard to rotate strong side and the backside wing to rotate up. In this slide (which Koufos really struggled to execute, Dallas does a good job and BJ is somewhere in the middle) strong side quickly becomes weak side, but, if there is a shot, the weak side should already be "overloaded" because of the quick ball rotation. In theory, the weakside wing and guard should already be in position and the strongside guard, who has rotated weak, should be matched as well. This may present a matchup problem somewhere in the paint of big offensive rebounder versus smaller defensive rebounder, but thats a sacrifice you make in order to "force" the shot from the corner - generally a much lower percentage shot. Point is, you should have at least two wing players and one guard in or near the paint to rebound. When those players are Lighty or Turner you see some good "covering down" and their athleticism makes up for matchup issues.

Some of our wings and guards struggle with their cover downs and/or other slides in the helpside. Here's the thing though, if they can't execute relatively short 6-8 foot defensive slides in the helpside in a scheme where they are already in position to make the slide, how can you depend on these kids to play good helpside in a man where they could be anywhere on the court? How can they be sure of their switching "dos and donts" when they are constantly in different situations? Matchup zone reduces variables and shortens help assignments.

By the way, the Bucks are a solid defensive team. I honestly don't know why there is so much noise about switching schemes in the first place.[/quote]

2005-02-25-inside-chaney.jpg


approves
 
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I tend to like zone but my fault with Matta would be his inability to switch up everyone once in a while. I'm fine playing a 2-3 zone 90% of the time and certainly Thad's approach works. However if you mix defenses up and go 1-3-1 or something of the sort that can really throw your opponent off balance.
 
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