OH RB Todd Sibley (Pitt Signee)

[jenkinswoody]

is it okay to do it to a kid from Indiana? Maryland? What if he didn't grow up a buckeye fan?

I would suggest that many of the complaints are more emotional more than strategic (upsetting future talent). Part of me certainly shares that emotional response, don't get me wrong.

I'd also echo that it's how business is done and has no relevance to how I was told to keep my word as a man. There is no honor in recruiting. All of his future suitors would dump him in a heartbeat if they thought they could get Najee. This isn't Jim Tressel's B1G, verbals and scholarship players are processed all the time. It's not nice, admirable or how a man conducts himself, but those have no relevance in the bug money game of college football.

Coaches bail after the kids are signed. Coaches and players make flimsy pinky swears about their futures. Coaches and players lie about the nature of offers. Coaches and players fill spots with non binding commitments and frequently reverse them if they find something better.

I hate this for Todd, who is a great kid by all accounts and was honorable and loyal. But while it's unkind, it's better to part ways now if both sides do not feel it is a good fit. It isn't helpful to either side to have him riding the pine behind Weber, Williams and maybe others for 3+ years like Warren Ball. He also has the talent to play big time college football and deserves the chance to chase that dream.

I think that you do recruit an Ohio kid differently than an Indiana or Maryland kid. Ohio schools will be and always have been the lifeblood of our program. There should be a different standard.

 

[BuckeyeNation27]

Way back before I followed recruiting, didn't Cooper really blow it in the Cinci region....which lead to a lot of Cinci kids going to Michigan and ND? I think things have changed a bit since then, but I still consider Cincinnati as out of state recruiting. When we lose a talented kid from there, I don't count it as losing an Ohio kid.

 

[pnuts34]

Way back before I followed recruiting, didn't Cooper really blow it in the Cinci region....which lead to a lot of Cinci kids going to Michigan and ND? I think things have changed a bit since then, but I still consider Cincinnati as out of state recruiting. When we lose a talented kid from there, I don't count it as losing an Ohio kid.

Tressel also focused little on Cincinnati recruiting, and that's foolish to discount Cincinnati as there is a good number of talented kids down here. And Urban has thankfully opened up the recruiting lines back here which is very smart! Imagine how that 2014 year would've been without Diesel Washington in the middle! Schools like Moeller, St. X, Colerain, LaSalle, etc would be great to have for pipelines to OSU. And the Catholic HSs have more to ND getting so many kids from Cincy. Your thinking is part of the reason why Cincinnati is divided from the state.

 

[jwinslow]

I think that you do recruit an Ohio kid differently than an Indiana or Maryland kid. Ohio schools will be and always have been the lifeblood of our program. There should be a different standard.

I agree they should be prioritized, handled delicately and protected for many reasons.

I still maintain the outcry is largely about how it feels and looks, not what it will mean. For the latter to be a big problem, it would require another comparable schools l that does not engage in this activity. I maintain that such a place does not exist.

The first school that pops to mind as a potential beneficiary is Sparty (albeit a different caliber of program). They may have done the exact same thing to another Hoban kid late last year. He landed at iu. If they didn't and that was just a coincidence, I could point to other verbal that they processed and essentially dropped.

It's not fun or respectable but it's how things are done these days.

 

[pnuts34]

I agree they should be prioritized, handled delicately and protected for many reasons.

I still maintain the outcry is largely about how it feels and looks, not what it will mean. For the latter to be a big problem, it would require another comparable schools l that does not engage in this activity. I maintain that such a place does not exist.

The first school that pops to mind as a potential beneficiary is Sparty (albeit a different caliber of program). They may have done the exact same thing to another Hoban kid late last year. He landed at iu. If they didn't and that was just a coincidence, I could point to other verbal that they processed and essentially dropped.

It's not fun or respectable but it's how things are done these days.

#crootin

 

[RB07OSU]

Put me firmly in the camp that you don't burn in-state bridges with kids that grew up dreaming of being Buckeyes. You certainly don't do it to chase a California kid once-committed to Alabama or a Mississippi kid once-committed to Alabama.

Aesop's Fable about a dog carrying a bone and seeing its reflection in the water and all of that ...

I agree with your sentiment overall but I am going to just focus on this specific instance rather than globally (which deserves its own thread imo). I don't think it is an issue of putting all of our eggs in the Harris/Akers basket. Rather, I think it is a general numbers issue with this class and realizing we have a very strict cap on this class. With the influx of big commitments in this class, I was curious as to how we would make this work. I had RB maxed out at 1 in this class and I believe the staff did as well, and it now looks like we have to make room for two. Even if we do not take another RB, do you turn down a Chase Young or a Donovan Peoples-Jones at another position? I don't know if that is the scenario but I think the staff has a really good pulse on it. Seems like tougher decisions than normal are having to be made in '17 due to numbers.

 

[Muck]

Ultimately this isn't about upsetting the Todd Sibleys of the world, it's about upsetting the Tim Tyrells. Do that often enough & you won't be coaching at a University in the State of Ohio for long.

 

[jwinslow]

Even if we do not take another RB, do you turn down a Chase Young or a Donovan Peoples-Jones at another position? I don't know if that is the scenario but I think the staff has a really good pulse on it. Seems like tougher decisions than normal are having to be made in '17 due to numbers.

There are two available scholarships for 2017. Not 2 more, 2 total. This class has unprecedented interest and equally unprecedented scholarship problems.

There is going to be a huge amount of attrition in the next 12 months. Prepare yourselves now. Also, Todd leaving this class does little to fix the problem. He might be replaced by someone else but that still doesn't make an opening for him (or anyone else) among the 85 spots.

 

[sparcboxbuck]

There are two available scholarships for 2017. Not 2 more, 2 total. This class has unprecedented interest and equally unprecedented scholarship problems.

There is going to be a huge amount of attrition in the next 12 months. Prepare yourselves now. Also, Todd leaving this class does little to fix the problem. He might be replaced by someone else but that still doesn't make an opening for him (or anyone else) among the 85 spots.

So, I presume that you're suggesting that there will be a number of players who can't / won't cut it in the program who will have the "if you want to see the field, you may want to look around" conversation. If that's the case, I'm wondering why some of those conversations didn't happen already.

And as an aside... could you imagine what this class would be like were it not for the early entry guys? Wow.

 

[jwinslow]

So, I presume that you're suggesting that there will be a number of players who can't / won't cut it in the program who will have the "if you want to see the field, you may want to look around" conversation. If that's the case, I'm wondering why some of those conversations didn't happen already.

And as an aside... could you imagine what this class would be like were it not for the early entry guys? Wow.

Yes. Probably about a dozen (unless anyone grayshirts).

83 returnees in 2017
20 signees in 2017
-----
103
-85 scholarship limit
------
18 over
- 4 nfl
- 2 medical this summer (they're 2 over)
-----------
12 over

Now there will be a few transfers, and a few behavioral dismissals, and maybe one or two guys that don't enroll due to grades or grayshirting, but that won't cover all of the scholarships. This is a very bad for anyone to get arrested, skip class or not do their jobs.

Many of these guys did not have opportunities to play until this offseason. That's what makes this even trickier. Usually you have better balance in departures and returning starters. This year almost everyone left.

The early departures are a triple whammy. They kept the great 14 + 15 classes from playing, they leave tons of openings for a very young team, and they leave microscopic senior class so almost no scholarships come off the books next spring.

The great draft class will help their recruiting but it allowed the staff to take a lot of low ranked sleepers late last year at the expense of kids in this class.

 

[redguard117]

Unfortunate situation, but at the end of the day we are competing against the Alabamas, LSUs, and Ole Mi$$' of the world. Without the luxury of their 'rule' books, we must do what we can to get the absolute maximum out of our talent.

Todd has a full year to figure out what he wants to do. The staff has been entirely up-front with him, and even offered him an avenue to remain a Buckeye if he truly desires to be so. It's an unfortunate situation, and one that would have been best to be avoided, but that's just the way it is nowadays. Better than recruiting 30 players every year and cutting the 10 we least like in April, like our Southern brethren

 

[youngbuck_9]

Best part: we, as in fans, don't have to stress getting to 85 scholarships ...

 

[RB07OSU]

The early departures are a triple whammy. They kept the great 14 + 15 classes from playing, they leave tons of openings for a very young team, and they leave microscopic senior class so almost no scholarships come off the books next spring.

The great draft class will help their recruiting but it allowed the staff to take a lot of low ranked sleepers late last year at the expense of kids in this class.

Bingo. This is why the banter of "banking scholarships for next year" always comes up. It is easily dismissed by most because "you don't waste scholarships" but now you are seeing a tangible hindrance on a class where top flight talent being turned away is becoming commonplace.

Not saying that you hold out spots in hopes for a next year, as we have had plenty of late sleepers that have turned into great players. Heck, even guys that I personally questioned late in the game like Davon Hamilton and Malik Hooker look primed to be big contributors to our team this year. But there are tangible effects of taking the absolute max number of commitments every year in the B1G. As @youngbuck_9 said though, at least it is not our job to make those decisions and I trust those who are making them.

 

[Smudger]

 

[Smudger]

Have to think Pitt will make a serious run at Todd. Just visited there this past weekend.