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2015 tOSU Defense Discussion

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I remember after the Texas loss in 05' AJ Hawk saying if a defense gives up more than 21 points then it's on them if they lose (which we did that night)

However yesterday we gave up 17 and while I am sickened at how we performed against a team with zero passing threat I do not feel the blame can be on the defense.

This defense all year has been thrown out on the field in horrible spots.. Either due to turnovers, penalties or lack of field position on the offenses part. This game was no different.

While I'm disappointed we didn't drop both safeties into the box or try adding a 5th defensive lineman the defense did ENOUGH to win. They certainly didnt blow the game for us but they certainly didn't make the game for us either.

I'm just always surprised at any coaching, in any sport, and at any level when a opponent does a particular thing well and when there isn't a all out assault to stop it. I get if Cook was playing you don't leave yourself open to the pass but it was raining, cold, and we were playing their back up QB. Crowd the line and attack the QB
 
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Jaxbuck said:
yeah me too

but when you find yourself in a game where 17 will lose it and you give it up then you aren't blameless
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Who's fault is it that we did not get over 17 points? We have been averaging 36 points per game this year. We only scored 14 points yesterday. You can not hold a top tier team to under 14 points. We only did it once last year to Wisconsin (I don't count Kent State and Illinois top tier teams). We have not played a top tier team all year to compare this year. The defense did enough to win this game.

The original argument was that the offense put the defense in a position to win. We had 46 yards passing and 86 yards rushing. We only had 5 first downs. One of the scoring drives was a one play drive as a result of a botched punt return. We were given the ball on the six yard line. I don't account this score to the offense at all. I will only credit the offense with 7 points. This was the result of the defense causing the fumble and giving the offense a 32 yard field to work with. The offense did not put the defense in a position to win this game. The offense made the defense's job much harder by having 7 3 and outs.

The offense had a chance to win the game at the end. They had possession with a tie game. All they had to do was drive down and get a field goal. Instead they went three and out and gave the ball back to MSU. The offense could not win this game.

We only gave up 3 more points than we have been averaging all year (14.2).
 
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Jaxbuck said:
Not to be lost in all the fun of blaming the offense for that fucking disaster, the defense gave up over 200 yards rushing at a 4 ypc clip to a team that couldn't run the ball all year, knowing they were going to run on almost every play.

Add to the ledger that they had the lead twice and gave it back on the ensuing drive each time.

Honestly as frustrating as the offense was, watching MSU just run it down the defenses throat was the most galling thing for me yesterday.
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We've known for a long time that power running is this defense' weakpoint.
Still, what do you expect when the opposing offense has more run plays than your team's total plays? Or your defense is out there for 38min? That's absurd and goes right back to the offense.
Giving up 17 points in 38min to a top-10 team... should've been more than enough to win it. If the offense could sustain a single drive all game, it's a win.
 
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buckeyesin07 said:
Agreed. And not to pinpoint one play or player, but man, that last offsides penalty on Bosa hurt. Dantonio was going for it on 4th and 8 from about OSU's 40, with MSU down 14-7. They probably have to pass on that play, something they hadn't done in the entire second half. Instead, they are able to call a running play on 4th and 3 after the penalty, and they convert. If OSU stops them on 4th and 8, we have the ball at our own 40 late in the game. I like our chances in that situation--even if we go 3 and out again, Cam probably pins them no worse than at their 25, and we're now very late in the game, and they need to drive the entire length of the field and score a TD just to tie. That offsides penalty was beyond huge.
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That offsides was huge. I agree 100%. If Bosa doesn't commit that foul, we could have very well won the game. Maybe not, but that was a pretty huge fuck up for his 3rd offsides of the game. It just pisses me off that if he makes a TE twitch that isn't even down they get the call.
 
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Buckeyefrankmp said:
They scored a season low 17 points. Did they not maul the other 10 teams?
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I you look at it in a vacuum, sure 17 points isn't great. But they didn't have their 1st round, program best QB. With the weather the way it was, they should have been able to hold msu to 17 points WITH Conner Cook. Without him 10 should have been a successful night for their offense. They had 90 yards passing, nearly half of that on one play. They had 200 yards running with the longest run being 20 yards (no 60 yard outlier type run). They were just pounding the ball 3 yards here, 5 yards there, 7 yards here, 9 yards there. You stop that by bringing another guy into the box. Yes, that 90 yards passing goes up, but that 200 yards rushing goes way down. Add to that the fact it gets the defense off the field more and gives the offense more time to hopefully find something right.

I'm not saying the defense deserves more blame than the offense, or really much blame at all. But you can't look at the point total and say "look, the defense was great."
 
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Key distinction:

Overall defensive effort was good. Holding a top ten team to 17 points should be good enough to win with the type of production that this program expects on offense. Situational defense was poor. They lost in nearly every high-leverage situation the game presented, giving up a third-and-long conversion, giving up a fourth down conversion, committing penalties, and getting manhandled at the end of the game.

These two points are not mutually exclusive.
 
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buckeyebri said:
Our LBs have been awful quiet this year. They don't seem to fill the gaps on the run. There was very little blitzing last night, which surprised me with MSU using a backup QB.
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They have been one of the more disappointing position groups on the team this year. Not that they have been bad, but they were supposed to be one of if not the best linebacking core in the country and they haven't been anywhere near that. Lee hasn't made as many big plays as he made last year. McMillan is steady but he makes a lot of his tackles after yards have been gained and Perry still takes too many brutal angles that lead to big plays.
 
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Tanner said:
They have been one of the more disappointing position groups on the team this year. Not that they have been bad, but they were supposed to be one of if not the best linebacking core in the country and they haven't been anywhere near that. Lee hasn't made as many big plays as he made last year. McMillan is steady but he makes a lot of his tackles after yards have been gained and Perry still takes too many brutal angles that lead to big plays.
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Sooo...fire Fickell?
 
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Wham said:
I have nothing good to say about the defense allowing the long run after we pinned them deep and then letting them drive all the way and give up the game...so I wo t say anything.
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The D was gassed at that point. Nothing left in the tank. The O couldn't hold the ball long enough to give the D a break the entire game. Also. The 14 points we did get out of the O, came from turnovers created by the D giving the O short field scores. Else we would not have scored at all cause the O couldn't maintain a drive if their life depended on it.
 
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