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OL Justin Boren (Official Thread)

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However, the death threats, if true, are really what prompted the criticism of WVU fans and I think you can agree, death threats would be over the line. I don't recall B***n getting any.
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Again, you'd be mistaken. They aren't taking theirs to the media, however.
 
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HailToMichigan;1148612; said:
You're right. I haven't played. So why don't you enlighten me and tell me what it's really all about?
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I'm unable to enlighten you and made no pretense of doing so. I haven't played in the Game, either. My point, again, is that you have no right to criticize someone who actually has and we're sick of you whining about it on BP. JB has given enough of himself to UM to make the choice and, although I wouldn't like it, I'd say the same if one of our stand-up guys transferred to TSUN.
 
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RugbyBuck;1148779; said:
I'm unable to enlighten you and made no pretense of doing so. I haven't played in the Game, either. My point, again, is that you have no right to criticize someone who actually has and we're sick of you whining about it on BP. JB has given enough of himself to UM to make the choice and, although I wouldn't like it, I'd say the same if one of our stand-up guys transferred to TSUN.
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Suh, jus' say th'word...

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RugbyBuck;1148779; said:
I'm unable to enlighten you and made no pretense of doing so. I haven't played in the Game, either. My point, again, is that you have no right to criticize someone who actually has and we're sick of you whining about it on BP. JB has given enough of himself to UM to make the choice and, although I wouldn't like it, I'd say the same if one of our stand-up guys transferred to TSUN.
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Then I wish you the opportunity to stand by your words if the time comes. As Grad pointed out, he is a Buckeye; I owe my loyalty to Wolverines, and you can't be both.
 
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HailToMichigan;1147992; said:
This 62-page thread is on the Buckeye site - one which spawned an entire separate site to follow every single team in college football as they chase 17 and 18 year old kids. There's nothing wrong with that, I'm as willing a participant as any, but let's not pretend that Buckeye fans are the ones rising above it all.
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First of all, he's a Buckeye. We can have as many threads about him as we want. :tongue2: Second, you are probably responsible for about 1/3 of the posts on those 62 threads (and counting) so what's your point?
 
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HailToMichigan;1148794; said:
Then I wish you the opportunity to stand by your words if the time comes. As Grad pointed out, he is a Buckeye; I owe my loyalty to Wolverines, and you can't be both.
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I think the point in this is that most of the Wolverine Nation (can I spell that here?) seemed to automatically assume it was Boren's fault and that he alone must be to blame for such a thing to happen. One would think that if you're honest with yourselves, you'd look deeper into the situation and realize their must be a very good reason why a stand up kid would want to transfer to OSU from TSUN. Because he loves the atmosphere and environment that JT and his staff have created here. Something he's not finding up north. Why everyone up north is so quick to blame the kid alone was the point of this discussion IMHO. It's bothersome that no one in your camp seems to think RR is at all at fault.

With that said, would Buckeye Nation do the same? With JT at the healm I'm pretty certain we won't have to worry about that. But if we did, I think those of us rational folks on this board would want to know what's going on deeper in the program...not just blame the kid. Would we support the kid and still be fans? Heck no. But I think our discussions would dig into what's really going on with the program.
 
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HailToMichigan;1147910; said:
I just don't think that anyone that played for Michigan (or OSU), and retained even a scrap of pride in that uniform and program and in what he had accomplished there, or any feeling or emotion associated with it, can then go suit up at OSU (or Michigan.) It's different from guys who grow up in one state or the other and choose to cross the border. It's even different from regular transfers. But when you put on the uniform, your investment in the place goes beyond simply being a fan. Or it should.

Either B***n never felt any attachment to Michigan in the first place, or Rich Rodriguez destroyed it in a few practices. In the latter case it couldn't have been terribly strong to begin with, as countless people have played at West Virginia and many others are still playing at Michigan without Rodriguez destroying their will to play there.

And yes, I think his "eroded family values" statement is a cop-out. To what, exactly, is he referring? It's vague and unquantifiable and open to all kinds of interpretation. If he just said, "I don't like being screamed at and cursed at," then that'd be something. At least Pat White was specific.

Pretty much everyone who's transferred from Michigan gave clear reasons. Justin Fargas - didn't want to be a defensive back. Matt Gutierrez and Jason Forcier - stuck on the depth chart. Ryan Mallett - wrong system. No worries there, and whenever I see Fargas playing in the NFL, I still think of him as a Wolverine, because he represented us well, even for a short time. Mallett, same (for the most part.) But to smack us in the face by jumping ship to OSU? And to add insult to insult and injury with vague statements that leave the program open to criticism without any real idea of what it's being criticized for? Can't accept that. I mean, even Rodriguez gave some pretty specific ideas as to why he left West Virginia. He laid them out.

If Michigan football was a family, as he said, his family members are still there. His former teammates. Going to OSU shows that he now holds them in less than no regard. It says, I not only want to leave you, I want to beat you so bad that I'll go to the one place where it's not only most likely, it's expected of me, and I'll pay my own money for the chance to do it.
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Going to OSU shows that he now holds them in less than no regard. It says, I not only want to leave you, I want to beat you so bad that I'll go to the one place where it's not only most likely, it's expected of me, and I'll pay my own money for the chance to do it.


That's the best part of this entire situation. He did get an education while he was in Ann Arbor and he's now not only wiser but happier in c-bus.:wink2:
 
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HailToMichigan;1148794; said:
As Grad pointed out, he is a Buckeye; I owe my loyalty to Wolverines, and you can't be both.
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Your loyalty to Michigan should also cause you to recognize that Justin, while now a Buckeye, was indeed a Wolverine and played very hard and well for Michigan (all-conference honorable mention, both media and coaches, as a true sophomore). You may not like his tranferring from Michigan to Ohio State, but don't belittle what he did for your team or disrespect him as a person. Keep in mind that he'd still be at Michigan had it not been for your new asshat head coach...
 
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buckeyes_rock;1148803; said:
I think the point in this is that most of the Wolverine Nation (can I spell that here?) seemed to automatically assume it was Boren's fault and that he alone must be to blame for such a thing to happen. One would think that if you're honest with yourselves, you'd look deeper into the situation and realize their must be a very good reason why a stand up kid would want to transfer to OSU from TSUN. Because he loves the atmosphere and environment that JT and his staff have created here. Something he's not finding up north. Why everyone up north is so quick to blame the kid alone was the point of this discussion IMHO. It's bothersome that no one in your camp seems to think RR is at all at fault.
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Well, I'll tell you why that is, though it's probably more a post for the RR thread. We already did our program-soul-searching before Carr left and we knew what we wanted in a new coach when it came time. We wanted a proven coach that's had success in his previous jobs; one who would change the country-club atmosphere around the team and get rid of the general feeling of complacency and whip guys into shape; one who could recruit well; one who did not bring with him the cloud of recruiting and academic scandal; and one who would tilt the OSU game back in our favor. On all of the above: check, check, check, and check, and now we wait on see on the last one. We got what we wanted, and how spoiled and disingenuous would we sound if we then said, "Oh, but wait, we want him to make sure every last kid from last year stays on the team by not yelling too much, and we want him to make a perfectly clean amicable break from his previous job too." If the lesson to be learned here is caveat emptor, or else maybe "you get what you ask for" then so be it. We got what we wanted. What do we do now - try and get RR fired? Maybe RR is "at fault", but since this is the program we asked for, we want players who want to play in it. If we hadn't demanded such a program then it would be easier to point fingers at the coach - however, the coach deserves a little longer than a three month grace period. A trend of players leaving citing family values - that would give us (me) cause to think. One player doesn't make a trend.
 
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