What's Wrong & How to Fix It (Merged)

[jwinslow]

What I think that we have seen is Troy Smith trying to establish himself as the "game winner". I think that he liked that feeling after the Michigan game so much that he wants to "win" every game. It is not enough for him to be part of the winning team-he wants to be the one that won it! He wants the big stats-200 passing/100 rushing, that makes him the MVP. That doesn't match with Tressell Ball, or even with team football, but that is what it looks like is going on. All the coaches efforts to get him to look for all his recievers just slows him down-he is still planning to run, except by then the defense is closing him in. A chance for a great highlight film! No, caught in the backfield, maybe a loss on the play, or even throwing into coverage for an interception.

In short, we have another "ego man". We have the best defense in the nation, but no signs of individual egos there. We have a quarterback that made it clear when someone else had the job that the team's problems were because he wasn't being given a chance to play. He got his chance and made the most of it. I applauded that and I was glad for the team. Since that though, it looks like Smith has become the focus of the offense-he won't use any of the other weapons. If #4 and #11 had some catches, I might agree that #7 was being mis-used. How can we even think that the coaches, the receivers, backs, and the line have all suddenly developed problems-but QB is good because "he beat Michigan"? No, The Buckeyes beat Michigan. If we want to beat Michigan again they had better either adjust Mr. Smith's view of team football or move him to the bench.

Perception vs. reality. The entire offense was moved by his speech about humility after the texas game.

Smith does try to make too much happen a lot. But it's a huge stretch to say a QB's lack of vision is b/c he doesn't want to use his WRs. Yes, I'm sure Smith loves getting pummeled by huge defensive lineman... and occasionally scrambling for 5 yards and getting punished again.

 

[Bucklion]

Perception vs. reality. The entire offense was moved by his speech about humility after the texas game.

Smith does try to make too much happen a lot. But it's a huge stretch to say a QB's lack of vision is b/c he doesn't want to use his WRs. Yes, I'm sure Smith loves getting pummeled by huge defensive lineman... and occasionally scrambling for 5 yards and getting punished again.

I can't put my finger on it, but it seems to me that Smith tries to make too much happen because of a lack of confidence in something, but I can't quite figure out what...I think you're right, it's not his receivers, so is it his protection, or his ability to throw downfield, or make the right read, or the plays that are being called, or....?

Just seems to me that, unlike CK for example, he just really never looks comfortable and in control out there.

I guess the solution would be to either call more plays with throws that he is comfortable making, or keep an extra guy in for protection, or something...depending on what it is.

 

[Taosman]

Losing Barton early in the game and having to shuffle the "O" line can't help when playing one of the best defenses in the country,away!

Any word on the Barton injury?

Any word on when Rehring will be back?

Both those guys are among our best lineman and would help!

 

[BrutusMaximus]

Did anybody notice that when we went into the I and ran the ball, there was ZERO hole there as usual. We need to throw out of that formation. When we're in the shotgun, 90% chance we're gonna throw, when we go in the I, 100% we're gonna run. Predictable?

I may be stepping over the edge just a tad, but I personally think the entire offensive coaching staff needs overhauled.

 

[scooter1369]

I may be stepping over the edge just a tad,

Do me favor and get off my fingers. I've been hanging from the ledge since 1 am Sunday.

 

[FritoBandito]

A few simple, I believe uncontestable, facts about this program -- some of which are unique to the JT Era, others of which are longer-term problems.

1. The OSU has never attracted or developed a great quarterback.

We proved in 2002 that you can win without a great QB, but as a general proposition, truly great teams normally have great QBs. Yet the OSU QB with the most successful NFL career is Tom Tupa. That ought to tell us something. Think of any other position: RBs Keith Byars, Eddie George, Robert Smith. WRs Joey Galloway, Chris Carter, Terry Glenn, David Boston. Linemen like Orlando Pace or LeCharles Bentley; LBs like Vrabel, Spielman or Gradishar; DBs like Winfield, Springs and Gamble etc. etc. etc. But never a QB. Never. Not once. That has been an Achilles heel for decades, not just under JT, and it simply has to be addressed. (I am not implying here that the OSU program is a disaster because it has never had a truly great QB. Far from it. Our success has been exceptional even without great QB play. But without ever having a great one, it's next-to-impossible for any program to achieve consistent excellence.)

2. The current OSU offensive 'braintrust' (a misnomer if ever there was one) is never going to attract or develop a great QB.

No truly great high school QB, or his father, would ever select Bollman or Daniels to develop their budding young superstar. Never, ever. Not a Mark Sanchez, not a Tim Tebow, not anybody.

3. The current OSU offensive staff gets less production out of more talent than any such staff in the Big Ten.

To paraphrase Winston Churchill, "Never have so many performed with such mediocrity for so long." Year after year, exceptional new offensive talent comes into the program, yet every year, tOSU offense under-achieves. Highly-touted players like Lydell Ross, Bam Childress and Justin Zwick don't get better under the tutelage of this offensive staff, they get worse. Consider this: Michigan State's Javon Ringer is tearing it up as a Freshman. NW's Freshman Tyrell Sutton is this weekend's highlight reel (against the same Wisconsin team tOSU never seems able to beat). But our Freshman phenom, Maurice Wells, can't even get on the field. JoePa's Freshmen WRs are putting up better numbers than our future-first-rounders Santonio Holmes or Ted Ginn. Something is wrong with this picture, folks. And it's not the talent of the players. It's the piss-poor player development and gorilla-headed gameplanning of this offensive staff.

4. JT has put tOSU squarely back among the elite four or five programs in the country.

In so doing, he has outgrown the need to surround himself with over-the-hill offensive assistants. Find a bright young offensive mind, who has a recent track record of exceptional player development and gameplanning, and hand the reins over to him. Surround him with a staff of his choosing, let him perform and sit back and enjoy the ride. Any young assistant in the country would accept an offer to take over the offense at tOSU. It would be a young coach's dream job -- just as coaching tOSU defense was for Mark D'Antonio and Mark Snyder.

5. Low-risk, low-scoring offense is not some hallowed OSU tradition. It's not 'smart' football.

Woody's ultraconservative teams racked up scores in the high 30s and 40s pretty frequently. He even laid 'half-a-hundred' on scUM back in the day.

For tOSU program to achieve its fullest potential -- for it to return to the BCS National Championship game sometime soon -- it's going to have to be able to score points. It's going to have to have an offensive staff that can recruit and develop great players, especially at QB. And it's going to have to know how to maximize the productivity of its most skilled players, not use them as decoys or coach them into medocrity.

 

[FKAGobucks877]

Offensive Line: This needs to improve. Were I making the decisions, I would fire Bollman and get rid of this retarded zone blocking scheme. If you want to argue that zone blocking works (which it can), then fine, hire someone who knows how to coach it. We have some of the best OL linemen in the country, with more of the best waiting in reserve. There is no excuse, NONE, for averaging less than 4 yards per carry and three seconds per pass.

QB: It's already been said.

Playcalling: Needs to improve. Unlike many, I do not have a big problem with the play-calling against PSU. I mean, we actually ran a screen...a real screen! The WR were definitely open...almost all the time. The QB just didn't see them.

Coaching: A lot of this is related to coaching, because ultimately it is the coaches responsibility. I would definitely like to see an OC, but don't think it will happen. I can't understand why the defense is still phenomenal when they are on their third coach in as many years, while the offense still sucks even though no changes have been made (save a couple of minor additions). This problem is OBVIOUSLY coaching. Tressel needs better assistants on the O side of the ball, period. I am also a fan of bringing in BG's guy, although I also do not think it will happen. I think the offensive production would double with the addition of a legitimate OL coach, such as Iowa's.

Intangibles: We need better leadership on the field in terms of performance. Save AJ Hawk and Carpenter, none of the seniors are dominant. Salley and Mangold have both made big mistakes, and there just doesn't seem to be any fire there. Ginn doesn't seem to have any heart whatsoever, and his obvious decline of fundamentals is disturbing. It would be my guess that he is personally struggling with something, whether it be football or his dad's illness, I don't know. I don't know that moving him to CB is the (an?) answer, but I do believe the younger WR's need to see more time, for they are too talented to be sitting while a starter is struggling.

Scheme - I do not agree that the offensive philosophy should change. I think the offense should play a scheme that best suits its strengths, and we have the WR's to play this scheme. I think that either Smith or Zwick would be better than average in this scheme, if the OL could only play up to their potential (see above). If not, then play TB or RS, whoever gets the job done. The ONLY weak spot on this offense (with regard to talent) is the QB spot, and we've seen so much that conflicts with both Zwick and Smith (when you compare last year to this year) that I do believe that *enough* talent is there with either one of them to make this offense roll. TB or RS may do better, at least eventually, but for now, concentrate on fixing the OL scheme, and let whatever QB plays get into a rhythm. I don't know that we would be all that unhappy with TS if he would have been practicing and playing with the ones for the last 10 months...but after the game Saturday, I don't know that we wouldn't, either.

 

[jwinslow]

Bmax, the coaching staff recycling has been discussed, but many have pointed out we need to keep hazell, who is our best recruiter and WR coach. But Bollman, Daniels and DTressel are not too popular

1. The OSU has never attracted or developed a great quarterback.

Three elite 11 QBs would tend to disagree with that. I agree tho we cant' develop anyone, not even to good college QB status.

 

[BrutusMaximus]

it's funny when you think back to the Coop days......we had a fantastic offense, and mediocre defenses. Just about every year. Now, we have fantastic D and Special teams, and horrid offenses every year. Still say we should hire Coop as the OC.........

*ducks*

 

[FKAGobucks877]

I'll give you the developed part, for it is obvious...but Zwick was the most highly recruited QB of 2001, and he chose tOSU.

 

[Pheasant]

I think the problem with the offense is the spread. Watching Northwestern and Michigan State run the spread versus watching tOSU run the spread is like night and day. NW and MSU seem to have a receiver open almost every play. tOSU seems to have someone open every 3rd play, and we don't connect when they are open. Troy seems to do a great job of going through his progressions, but he seems to be going through them simply to go through them, not in any effort to complete a pass. I may be wrong, it just seems as if he's doing it so he can say he did it before he ran. If Zwick wasn't good enough to be the starter, neither is Smith. Put Boeckman in and see what he can do.

I also don't like TGII on offense at this point. His routes aren't that crisp, but a lot of times they are crisp enough. He was open a number of times against PSU (notably on a wheel route that was an easy 6 if he had been thrown the ball) but we aren't getting him the ball. He could make plays on defense, and playing CB every down IMHO would get him into the flow of the game much more than playing WR would, which I think would get rid of his east-west kick return habit. Then we could use him on a few offensive plays and keep the defense on their toes.

The scary part about all the problems we have on offense is that we still could have beaten PSU. I have no doubt in my mind that if they called half of the holding penalties we would have won. Kudla will probably have permanent scars after the repeated rapings he took.

 

[Jaxbuck]

I'll give you the developed part, for it is obvious...but Zwick was the most highly recruited QB of 2001, and he chose tOSU.

I'll touch on this one.

That Elite 11 QB class ended up sending 2 players to OSU and I think its fair to say after 4 years they aren't exactly world beaters.

That same class iirc contained Stanton from MSU, McNeil from T A&M, and VY from Texas.

Now, you tell me how 3 of those 5 are pretty damn good college football players and the 2 that came to OSU are mediocre at best? Did we just get unlucky and find the two duds at an Elite 11 camp? I just don't buy it, maybe if one never panned out but not when its a daily double.

You can discuss the offensive situation ad nauseum from every imaginable angle and everyone would be partially right. Ultimately it boils down to the people in charge simply ain't getting it done and have plenty of time to right the ship...time for some new people to steer the ship(offensively).

 

[FritoBandito]

Three elite 11 QBs would tend to disagree with that. I agree tho we cant' develop anyone, not even to good college QB status.

The three are all Ohio kids and none has as yet proved a thing in the Horseshoe. And under the current 'over-the-hill gang' of offensive staff, not one of them will, I'm afraid.

But the main point is this: The OSU quarterback with the most successful NFL career is a punter! That's not Bollman or Daniels' fault. It's an institutional issue. TOSU suffers from its long-time reputation for weak QB play.

Until we start scoring points, under the leadership of a bright, aggressive young offensive coaching staff, we will never have the kind of QB it takes to achieve consistent excellence.

 

[jwinslow]

The three are all Ohio kids and none has as yet proved a thing in the Horseshoe. And under the current 'over-the-hill gang' of offensive staff, not one of them will, I'm afraid.

Guess we better send all of our Ohio kids back, and just recruit from Florida. Better tell Chris, Connor and others not to come, either. I'm not sure where you're getting that b/c they're from Ohio their rating is less meaningful.

Jax, I agree with your opinion about that recruiting class, but misery loves company :) Reggie from aTm is having his struggles too. He's doing worse that Smith IMO (SMU and Texas St are guaranteed good games).

<table class="tablehead" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"> <tbody><tr class="stathead" align="center" bgcolor="#6a3333"><td colspan="3" align="left">2005 Game Log</td><td colspan="8">Passing</td><td colspan="6">Rushing</td></tr> <tr class="colhead" align="right"><td align="left">DATE</td><td align="left">OPP</td><td align="left">RESULT </td><td> CMP</td> <td>ATT</td> <td>YDS</td> <td>CMP%</td> <td>LNG</td> <td>TD</td> <td>INT</td> <td>RAT</td> <td>ATT</td> <td>YDS</td> <td>AVG</td> <td>LNG</td> <td>TD</td> </tr><tr class="oddrow" align="right"><td align="left">9/3</td><td align="left">@Clemson</td><td align="left">L 25-24 </td><td>8</td> <td>16</td> <td>110</td> <td>50.0</td> <td>31</td> <td>1</td> <td>1</td> <td>67.2</td> <td>9</td> <td>100</td> <td>11.1</td> <td>49</td> <td>0</td> </tr> <tr class="evenrow" align="right"><td align="left">9/17</td><td align="left">SMU</td><td align="left">W 66-8 </td><td>15</td> <td>24</td> <td>349</td> <td>62.5</td> <td>80</td> <td>5</td> <td>0</td> <td>145.8</td> <td>6</td> <td>100</td> <td>16.7</td> <td>63</td> <td>1</td> </tr> <tr class="oddrow" align="right"><td align="left">9/22</td><td align="left">Texas State</td><td align="left">W 44-31 </td><td>13</td> <td>24</td> <td>317</td> <td>54.2</td> <td>71</td> <td>2</td> <td>0</td> <td>127.1</td> <td>11</td> <td>86</td> <td>7.8</td> <td>35</td> <td>0</td> </tr> <tr class="evenrow" align="right"><td align="left">10/1</td><td align="left">Baylor</td><td align="left">W 16-13 </td><td>12</td> <td>31</td> <td>132</td> <td>38.7</td> <td>24</td> <td>0</td> <td>2</td> <td>25.2</td> <td>12</td> <td>83</td> <td>6.9</td> <td>39</td> <td>0</td> </tr> <tr class="oddrow" align="right"><td align="left">10/8</td><td align="left">@Colorado</td><td align="left">L 41-20 </td><td>10</td> <td>21</td> <td>146</td> <td>47.6</td> <td>60</td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td> <td>70.7</td> <td>5</td> <td>-14</td> <td>-2.8</td> <td>4</td> <td>0</td></tr></tbody> </table>

 

[FKAGobucks877]

I think the problem with the offense is the spread. Watching Northwestern and Michigan State run the spread versus watching tOSU run the spread is like night and day. NW and MSU seem to have a receiver open almost every play. tOSU seems to have someone open every 3rd play, and we don't connect when they are open. Troy seems to do a great job of going through his progressions, but he seems to be going through them simply to go through them, not in any effort to complete a pass. I may be wrong, it just seems as if he's doing it so he can say he did it before he ran. If Zwick wasn't good enough to be the starter, neither is Smith. Put Boeckman in and see what he can do.

Understand your point, but disagree. Smith was obviously locking onto one receiver the majority of the time, and it was sickening to me at how he missed WR's that were SO wide open.

The scary part about all the problems we have on offense is that we still could have beaten PSU. I have no doubt in my mind that if they called half of the holding penalties we would have won. Kudla will probably have permanent scars after the repeated rapings he took.

Nail on the head. Even the announcers were pointing those out...and they were blatantly flagrant. See my thread regarding this subject that I started last week...