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ESPN (A bunch of Death-Spiraling maroons)

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We'll all just have to agree to disagree, still think the talent level dwarfed the rest the Big Ten. Miami was the only game that was more then 7 points... and I just think a real HC finds a way to win those games... Really no team in the Big Ten was dominate that year.. Meyers did a great job getting them the team focused and back to owning the Big Ten, just don't see it a huge turnaround to a program that I guess some here do.

But back on topic, 2 of the 3 coaches have shown that they can build a championship team... one hasn't done it... might in time, but has yet to prove it. Saban though has to get some huge negatives for how he did at Mich State, and even stated you couldn't win there.... seems they are doing pretty good these days. (though looking bad winning this year... LOL)
 
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pnuts34 said:
You're forgetting the amount of talent that was lost, regardless of the coach. Even with the coach, our down year still had a true frosh QB and another QB that had no accuracy whatsoever. Tress and Neyer would've lost multiple games with no Pryor, Posey or Adams, and Boom out for a 1/4 of the year. What Meyer did in one year was nothing short of amazing, as he had very little of the type of talent that he has now, or that fit his system.
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NFBuck said:
One loss? Doubtful. That team had Joe freaking Bauserman and a very raw true frosh Braxton at QB. The suspensions killed the skill positions and the OL. with Tressel, that was an 8-4 team...maybe. Meyer may have pulled off 9 wins with brax in his offense. But that was not a good team after the tat-gate fallout.
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Miami 6-24
Sparty 7 - 10
Nebbie 27 - 34
Purdue 23 - 26 OT
PSU 14 - 20
TSUN 34 - 40
Florida 17 - 24

Ohio State lost five games by an average of less than a TD. It's not unreasonable to say that with an experienced staff in place it would have gone into bowl season with only a single loss.
 
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pnuts34 said:
That year was an anamoly, Alabama had quite a down time with Price and Shula. Yes 2005 was 10-2, but you failed to say what the records were before and after those years (2003 4-9, 2004 6-6 and 2006 6-6)? And Sabans first year they went 7-6 before he turned them around. So yeah, there was a good amount of work to do, and Saban did an amazing turn around.
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Obviously the year he was fired wasn't going to be pretty, so I went to the next year.
Unlike a number of other programs we could discuss (Stanford, MSU, Duke, GTech, etc.) ... Bama had the talent. Did they have the coaching to develop that talent? No.
Saban is an outstanding coach, but if I were a Minnesota... he's not going to rebuild that program. His time in the MAC and MSU was underwhelming.


And I'd point out that building a Championship team - esp doing so at a traditional powerhouse - isn't even remotely the same thing as rebuilding a program. Different skillset with some overlap.
 
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Muck said:
Miami 6-24
Sparty 7 - 10
Nebbie 27 - 34
Purdue 23 - 26 OT
PSU 14 - 20
TSUN 34 - 40
Florida 17 - 24

Ohio State lost five games by an average of less than a TD. It's not unreasonable to say that with an experienced staff in place it would have gone into bowl season with only a single loss.
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I've blocked out a lot of that season, but that Sparty loss was 100% on the offensive coaches. MSU was crashing hard on the inside run with no concern for backside contain, any kind of bootleg would have gone for massive yardage if we make the adjustment.

We lost to Purdue because the team was in celebratory mode before they actually took the lead.

8-4 at worst with an experienced coach and competent offensive coaching staff, 10-2 being the most likely outcome IMO. We went undefeated in 2012 with a very similar team talent wise.
 
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"Saban didn't have to rebuild anything at Bama"
"He's won 4 national championships but no way he could cut it in the Mac"
:slappy:

I love when people try to cite Michigan St like he isn't that great of a coach. As if he is the same coach now as he was in the late 90s.
 
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Back to ESPN....

Last week...


This week...



GPlus_Skeptical_Third_World_Kid.jpg
 
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Sgt Brutus said:
"Saban didn't have to rebuild anything at Bama"
"He's won 4 national championships but no way he could cut it in the Mac"
:slappy:

I love when people try to cite Michigan St like he isn't that great of a coach. As if he is the same coach now as he was in the late 90s.
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And I love it when people make up strawmans that were never stated or implied.
Saban does great when he has a talent advantage. He's promptly left every situation where he didn't, and with records that don't come close to what he's done elsewhere.
Give him raw talent and he'll get them to play to their potential year after year. That's nothing to sneeze at. Surprisingly few coaches can do that. But the facts remain, he couldn't cut it with 3stars or NFL's parity.
He couldn't do what Harbaugh, Dantonio, or Tressel have done. Or even Meyer at other times in his career.
If you want a coach to lead you to an NC, he and Urban are in a class of their own -- but that wasn't the topic. The topic was whose best to rebuild a program. Well, that's not what Saban does. He wouldn't even take that job... and if he did, he'd be gone within a few years for a place that doesn't need to be rebuilt from the ground up.
 
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MaxBuck said:
It would be nice if someone would ask Baylor to play an actual Division 1 collegiate team rather than the motley collection of high schools and D3 squads they routinely pack their early schedule with.
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I agree, of course. Making it worse, in my opinion, is that Ohio State's schedule over the years has been a constant source of ridicule and "evidence" that the Buckeyes were somehow, fake good... or whatever.
 
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Buckeyeskickbuttocks said:
I agree, of course. Making it worse, in my opinion, is that Ohio State's schedule over the years has been a constant source of ridicule and "evidence" that the Buckeyes were somehow, fake good... or whatever.
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Baylor's pre-conference slate makes the Buckeyes look like we've been playing the Bears, Packers and Steelers.
 
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kujirakira said:
And I love it when people make up strawmans that were never stated or implied.
Saban does great when he has a talent advantage. He's promptly left every situation where he didn't, and with records that don't come close to what he's done elsewhere.
Give him raw talent and he'll get them to play to their potential year after year. That's nothing to sneeze at. Surprisingly few coaches can do that. But the facts remain, he couldn't cut it with 3stars or NFL's parity.
He couldn't do what Harbaugh, Dantonio, or Tressel have done. Or even Meyer at other times in his career.
If you want a coach to lead you to an NC, he and Urban are in a class of their own -- but that wasn't the topic. The topic was whose best to rebuild a program. Well, that's not what Saban does. He wouldn't even take that job... and if he did, he'd be gone within a few years for a place that doesn't need to be rebuilt from the ground up.
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Small sample size from the 90s so I am not sure how you can say for certain he can't do what those other coaches did.

You're basing you arguement from 1 year at Toledo (9-2) and 5 years at Michigan st (34-24-1); last year went (9-2). Right now, I'm willing to bet he could go to almost ANY program and turn them around. He's a great recruiter and coach. We don't even know if Meyer, Dantonio, Tressel could cut it at the NFL either.

There's very little substance backing up what you are saying. You could be right but we just don't know with the sample size given. In addition, it's hard to believe he hasn't evolved and improved as a coach since his Michigan St days.
 
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