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Cleveland Browns (2011 season)

Bucky Katt;2087699; said:
Him? Holy hell, when I saw his name mentioned earlier, I was thinking that he wouldn't be a bad guy to take a flier on in the 5th round. The first round? :lol:

Yeah, that was a "wait, wut?" moment for me too.

Really, I was thinking 3rd or 4th, and I'm thinking, NF, after all he's been through is going to be done with the Browns for blowing a 4th round pick? That's the least of our worries.

To be honest. to me, this year is the one where we need to expect improvement... I understand that its the NFL and people are impatient. But by any objective measure, this team overachieved in '09 and '10 compared to the talent level as a whole. We sucked in '09, and somehow, with the benefit of some late opponents that were other wise distracted, the Mangenius got them motivated, maybe to make sure they didn't all get fired, dunno. Last year, Hillis caught lightning in a bottle... whatever.

This year ('11) was about what they were capable of. the Defense is much better and much more consistent, though we will need a few upgrades.

The bad part is that the '11 draft was more of a "maintenance" draft than an "add talent" draft. Took Taylor to replace Rogers. Little to replace, well whatever average receiver he replaced. Cameron wasn't a position of need. Marecic to replace Vickers (in an attmept to get a more WCO type FB, I guess). And the rest of the guys were kind of see what we can get. That really leaves Sheard as the only obivous upgrade over the position he replaced and part of that was schematic. (Little should have been an upgrade, but, whatever)

But, the good news is, in drafts like that you get younger if they pan out, and really, compared to the past, there haven't been too many misses. Hell, you can't even get pissed about Hillis, he wasn't supposed to do anything and we got to get rid of Brady Quinn to get him.

Couple things I'd like to see regardless of who they pick. I think we need a veteran WR. the younger recievers on this team, and I include Cribbs in this need a mentor, to shoe them how to do things in the league. When was the last time we had a vet receiver that had any real success that didn't get a staph infection or run over someone in the street? They need not be the #1 on the team, and you could still draft another one. But, we need some help there.

Also need to get faster, generally, at linebacker. And another CB. I think we do that, and Sheard and Taylor having a year under their belts and the run D should improve.

Seems like they want to bring Stienbach back, probably at a pay cut, so, need some help on the right of the OL...

So, then it all comes back to RB and QB. That's the trick. I think they are gong to play up RGIII like crazy, hope someone thinks he's Cam Newton and trade down.

Still leaves us with Colt, but, I think Holgren probably beleives in the 3 years to blossom rule... so... we're stuck with him unless a deal too good to turn down comes along. If they think Trent Richardson is the guy, they should try to get him I guess.

I'm still curious how this whole Peyton Manning/Andrew Luck thing is going to shake itself out. This is different than Favre/Rodgers. I mean, Rodgers was quite a bit later in the first and Favre didn't have a long term deal at the time. So, we're talking a lot more resources... a #1 pick and its cap space and big contract, long term at one position. Not to say that the Browns should try to get Peyton, I'm more saying that there will be downstream impact, who does try to get Peyton and what dominoes does that knock over? Random thought. (They also need to pay some other folks on a bad team, dunno what they do there)
 
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AKAK;2087998; said:
Yeah, that was a "wait, wut?" moment for me too.

Really, I was thinking 3rd or 4th, and I'm thinking, NF, after all he's been through is going to be done with the Browns for blowing a 4th round pick? That's the least of our worries.

To be honest. to me, this year is the one where we need to expect improvement... I understand that its the NFL and people are impatient. But by any objective measure, this team overachieved in '09 and '10 compared to the talent level as a whole. We sucked in '09, and somehow, with the benefit of some late opponents that were other wise distracted, the Mangenius got them motivated, maybe to make sure they didn't all get fired, dunno. Last year, Hillis caught lightning in a bottle... whatever.

This year ('11) was about what they were capable of. the Defense is much better and much more consistent, though we will need a few upgrades.

The bad part is that the '11 draft was more of a "maintenance" draft than an "add talent" draft. Took Taylor to replace Rogers. Little to replace, well whatever average receiver he replaced. Cameron wasn't a position of need. Marecic to replace Vickers (in an attmept to get a more WCO type FB, I guess). And the rest of the guys were kind of see what we can get. That really leaves Sheard as the only obivous upgrade over the position he replaced and part of that was schematic. (Little should have been an upgrade, but, whatever)

But, the good news is, in drafts like that you get younger if they pan out, and really, compared to the past, there haven't been too many misses. Hell, you can't even get pissed about Hillis, he wasn't supposed to do anything and we got to get rid of Brady Quinn to get him.

Couple things I'd like to see regardless of who they pick. I think we need a veteran WR. the younger recievers on this team, and I include Cribbs in this need a mentor, to shoe them how to do things in the league. When was the last time we had a vet receiver that had any real success that didn't get a staph infection or run over someone in the street? They need not be the #1 on the team, and you could still draft another one. But, we need some help there.

Also need to get faster, generally, at linebacker. And another CB. I think we do that, and Sheard and Taylor having a year under their belts and the run D should improve.

Seems like they want to bring Stienbach back, probably at a pay cut, so, need some help on the right of the OL...

So, then it all comes back to RB and QB. That's the trick. I think they are gong to play up RGIII like crazy, hope someone thinks he's Cam Newton and trade down.

Still leaves us with Colt, but, I think Holgren probably beleives in the 3 years to blossom rule... so... we're stuck with him unless a deal too good to turn down comes along. If they think Trent Richardson is the guy, they should try to get him I guess.

I'm still curious how this whole Peyton Manning/Andrew Luck thing is going to shake itself out. This is different than Favre/Rodgers. I mean, Rodgers was quite a bit later in the first and Favre didn't have a long term deal at the time. So, we're talking a lot more resources... a #1 pick and its cap space and big contract, long term at one position. Not to say that the Browns should try to get Peyton, I'm more saying that there will be downstream impact, who does try to get Peyton and what dominoes does that knock over? Random thought. (They also need to pay some other folks on a bad team, dunno what they do there)

next year is looking to be a much better qb crop all around. you'll have barkley, landry jones, and tyler wilson as definites. then you have kids like aaron murray and tyler bray that could blow up as well as any other sleepers that show up big time.

if cleveland rolls with mccoy next year and he stinks, then they will be in prime position to snare a qb, plus, there will be more talent around him so he won't be fed to the wolves.
 
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tsteele316;2088007; said:
next year is looking to be a much better qb crop all around. you'll have barkley, landry jones, and tyler wilson as definites. then you have kids like aaron murray and tyler bray that could blow up as well as any other sleepers that show up big time.

if cleveland rolls with mccoy next year and he stinks, then they will be in prime position to snare a qb, plus, there will be more talent around him so he won't be fed to the wolves.

Yeah, I mean, if they look at RGIII and say to themselves, "WOW, THAT'S OUR GUY!" I think you need to do it.

I don't think they're thinking that though... They know they need more pieces... and will do what they can. I think that's regardless of what they think is available next year. Be interesting to see who the OC is.
 
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WTF can't this batshit franchise be happy with letting someone else overdraft a QB? Fucking crikey, everyone laughs when Al Davis takes Heyward-Bey at #7, or when Jacksonville takes a 3rd round DT at the end of round 1...but by God, if Tannehill is there at 22, I can just see Heckert or Holmgren coming out and saying "Well, if we wouldn't have taken him, someone else would have". Well congrat-u-fucking-lations, but if that someone else is a fuckstick for overdrafting, all it shows is you're dumber than them...THINK GODDAMMIT
 
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Bucklion;2088086; said:
WTF can't this batshit franchise be happy with letting someone else overdraft a QB? Fucking crikey, everyone laughs when Al Davis takes Heyward-Bey at #7,

He may end up having the last (dead) laugh with that one.
 
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Bucklion;2088086; said:
WTF can't this batshit franchise be happy with letting someone else overdraft a QB? Fucking crikey, everyone laughs when Al Davis takes Heyward-Bey at #7, or when Jacksonville takes a 3rd round DT at the end of round 1...but by God, if Tannehill is there at 22, I can just see Heckert or Holmgren coming out and saying "Well, if we wouldn't have taken him, someone else would have". Well congrat-u-fucking-lations, but if that someone else is a fuckstick for overdrafting, all it shows is you're dumber than them...THINK GODDAMMIT

It would never happen that way. They'll trade next year's first rounder to move up three spots to make extra sure that they get him.
 
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I don't want Tannehill either (at least not in the first 4 rounds of the draft). In fact, I don't really want them to take a QB at all in this years draft unless it is some project in the 5th/6th round (Holmgren says he likes to bring in a QB almost every offseason, didn't he?)
QB class is pretty weak this year, outside of Luck of course. I think RGIII could be special, but I don't really want the Browns to take him and if we can get the Redskins to sell the farm to move up and take him, then more power to us. Spread shotgun QB from the Big 12 worries the hell out of me.


With that being said, I am not on the Colt bandwagon, but I am willing to give him another year. You can say that he had crap around him, which was true, but I still believe that QBs make WRs, not the other way around. McCoy is still very young, however, and this was his first year running the WCO in a very short offseason. Willing to give him another year with a retooled offense and besides, next QB class looks to be stacked. Looks like the Browns won't be bad enough (never say never with this team though...) to get Barkley and I don't know if I would even want him but that Wilson kid from Arkansas looks like he could be a solid NFL QB.


Very important offseason for the Browns and it looks like Steinbach is going to be healthy which is a huge plus. Still have the right side of the line to fix, and of course the skill players, could, uh, definitely use some help.
 
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bucks93;2088222; said:
I think RGIII could be special, but I don't really want the Browns to take him and if we can get the Redskins to sell the farm to move up and take him, then more power to us. Spread shotgun QB from the Big 12 worries the hell out of me.

problem is if the redskins are going to sell the farm its not going to be to us...its going to be to the rams at #2...pretty good spot for them to be in...they can move down and get an OT that they need without overpaying
 
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y0yoyoin;2088230; said:
problem is if the redskins are going to sell the farm its not going to be to us...its going to be to the rams at #2...pretty good spot for them to be in...they can move down and get an OT that they need without overpaying

no they can't. the OT class is Matt Kalil, then a huge dropoff, then the rest. the only realistic threat of drafting griffin before washington is cleveland. neither rams nor minnesota have any incentive to drop down in the draft and give up an elite LT or CB prospect when the second tier of guys is so much lower.

there's a better chance of a team below washington moving up to cleveland's spot to jump the redskins than there is the redskins trading with minny or the rams.
 
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tsteele316;2088251; said:
no they can't. the OT class is Matt Kalil, then a huge dropoff, then the rest. the only realistic threat of drafting griffin before washington is cleveland. neither rams nor minnesota have any incentive to drop down in the draft and give up an elite LT or CB prospect when the second tier of guys is so much lower.

there's a better chance of a team below washington moving up to cleveland's spot to jump the redskins than there is the redskins trading with minny or the rams.

well we will see...we are talking about washington giving up the farm...which in dan snyders case is a huge island in Dubai, along with 2 1st round picks, their 2nd, 4th, 6th along with next years 3rd and even possibly another future first rounder...i could see it happening

and i did find a list of every FA in 2012...pretty decent crop of FA's...of note

http://www.rotoworld.com/articles/nfl/39667/59/nfl-free-agent-master-list


* = likely will be franchise tagged.

Quarterbacks

Drew Brees *
Matt Flynn *
Kyle Orton
Chad Henne
Alex Smith
Jason Campbell
http://www.rotoworld.com/player/NFL/1483/David-GarrardVince Young
http://www.rotoworld.com/player/NFL/4706/Josh-JohnsonShaun Hill

Running Backs

Ray Rice *
Matt Forte *
Michael Bush *
Marshawn Lynch
Peyton Hillis
Cedric Benson
Mike Tolbert
Kevin Smith
http://www.rotoworld.com/player/NFL/4287/Jason-SnellingBenJarvus Green-Ellis
Tim Hightower
http://www.rotoworld.com/player/NFL/4651/Steve-SlatonRyan Grant

Wide Receivers

Vincent Jackson
Dwayne Bowe *
Wes Welker *
Brandon Lloyd
Marques Colston
DeSean Jackson
Stevie Johnson
Reggie Wayne
Robert Meachem
Mario Manningham
Pierre Garcon
Laurent Robinson
http://www.rotoworld.com/player/NFL/3126/Braylon-EdwardsEarly Doucet
Ted Ginn
Plaxico Burress
http://www.rotoworld.com/player/NFL/3197/Roscoe-ParrishJerome Simpson
http://www.rotoworld.com/player/NFL/1618/Jerricho-CotcheryEddie Royal
Steve Smith (PHI)

Offensive Linemen

Carl Nicks
Jared Gaither
Ben Grubbs
Evan Mathis
Chris Myers
Jeff Backus
Kareem McKenzie
Jake Scott
Chilo Rachal
Samson Satele
Bobbie Williams
Max Starks
Scott Wells
Nick Hardwick
Demetrius Bell
Matt Birk
Jeff Saturday
Mike Brisiel
Jeremy Zuttah
James Lee
Jacob Bell
 
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Not that the Browns don't need a RB but I would go with Blackmon if he is available. Look at the successful playoff teams right now, they all throw the ball a lot. Running is almost a secondary thought anymore in the NFL it seems. I think a good TE would help the Browns as well. I have always liked Koger (aside from going to ScUM)l, but I have no idea what would be a good place to grab him.
 
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My perfect draft would get Blackmon with the first pick and then have Richardson fall far enough that the Browns could trade up a little with the Falcons pick to get him. If he could get within 5 picks of the Falcons pick they might be able to swing it for throwing in a 3rd or 4th round pick. If Blackmon is gone I'd have to hope that Washington is dumb enough to trade up for RGIII so the Browns could draft Richardson and use what they get to trade down to move the Falcons pick up enough for Floyd.
 
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exhawg;2089061; said:
My perfect draft would get Blackmon with the first pick and then have Richardson fall far enough that the Browns could trade up a little with the Falcons pick to get him. If he could get within 5 picks of the Falcons pick they might be able to swing it for throwing in a 3rd or 4th round pick. If Blackmon is gone I'd have to hope that Washington is dumb enough to trade up for RGIII so the Browns could draft Richardson and use what they get to trade down to move the Falcons pick up enough for Floyd.

Which means they'll draft Tannenbaum and some DB we've never heard of, but who has "incredible measurables" in the combine....
 
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