Game Thread THE GAME: #1 Ohio State 42, #2 Michigan 39 (11/18/06)

[rocketman]

Our defense this year is not what I would call as "stout" as last years defense, however the scoreboard disagrees with me. I remember the LB trio last year dominating the line of scrimmage, yet our scoring D this year is regoddamndiculous. It's hard to really compare these two groups because the difference in playing style is very evident in contrast to to last year (with much respect to Pitcock and Patterson).

I guess this is another question for the stat gurus, but compared to last year, what has been the quality of the offenses we have faced this season? Also, I find it surprising that teams continue to move away from the run, even after they might have ran successfully against us. The Texas and Iowa games being the biggest examples, IMO. Maybe it's playing with fire, to stick with the run, because pretty soon you're going to run out of time - as happened with Texas. They ran all over us, killed tons of clock, and came up with no points. Then we put a lead on them and you have to question, will we be able to catch up if we continue with the run game? I'd like to think the offense complements the defense very nicely this year.

If you go back and rewatch those TDs, make sure you watch the plays before the TDs. I think all but one of those TDs came after Troy made plays on third and long with his feet or arm.....Or both in the instance of the third and long scramble and throw to Gonzo just before Pitt's TD. It is Troy's ability to buy time and make plays on third downs that is the key to this offense.

No doubt, especially after long 3rd down scrambles. I'm not coach or football expert but you got to think that long 3rd down QB scrambles have got to be the most demoralizing, back-breaking thing to happen to a defense. So, why not kick 'em while they're down with a long bomb?

 

[BuckeyeGanoosh]

Then we put a lead on them and you have to question, will we be able to catch up if we continue with the run game?

As of yet, the answer to that has been no. I know I'm not the only one that saw Charles putting 8-12 yds a pop, and I also know you were just as nervous as I was seeing that long first drive of Texas (minus a killer fumble at the 2). We are significantly better now than we were even just a month later, but remember that Texas has some serious studs on their OL. Northern Illinois had one serious stud on the OL, and could count on Wolfe making us miss. Hart is not like either of these backs, and has a good combination of speed and power, not too unlike Pittman with a slightly lower center of gravity. It's been the quick that has hurt us this year, so my confidence in the face of Michael Hart being pounded down on us is growing week by week. Caulcrick (sp?) was the biggest back we faced this year, and he couldn't do squat, although the OL of tsun is considerably better than MSU's.

Now on the line of why Texas and Iowa slowed the horses is up for debate, but Rock3tm4nn can't be very far off when he mentions that tOSU's offense puts enough threat in the proverbial air that the opposing coaches feel that they need to stretch out the field just to keep up with this offense. Troy Smith with all the other weapons can speed and slow the game to HIS liking, and that kind of dominance definitely affects the play-calling on the other side of the ball. It's almost unnaturally smooth at times, albeit us buckeyes not having this kind of consistency on offense in the past few years, conditioning us to great records but paltry offensive output.

Even if Texas attempts to run, run, run in that game, they're still going to have to stop Troy from marching down the field in 2:00 at the end of the first half. It was almost automatic, Troy moving the offense at will when the score got knotted up. These are the kind of drives that will kill the opposing team?s charisma, including those 3rd and long runs and scrambling throws followed by the bomb to Ginny. Tsun is going to really try to keep this game on the ground, and considering we have 4-5 quality receivers including 2 proven stars and the most consistent player in the country, I think we'll be sitting just fine.

When someone gets closer than 17 like #2 Texas, MAYBE I'll be just a hair nervous about The Game at the shoe.

....but it isn't likely.

 

[smartone]

I think this year's defense can be considered excellent only after the last game. I realize the statistics so far suggest they are better than last year's. But I don't accept that unless they maintain these numbers in every game this year. And we're not yet done. If they continue, as much as I loved the style and effectiveness of last year's defense, I will finally surrender to this year's defense. Just keep thinking they're gonna blow up one game. It's a stupid thought based solely on the amount of yardage we've given up.

There's a saying I learned in a statistics course: "There are lies, damned lies, and statistics"

On converting on 3rd downs: I certainly hope we don't have too many 3rd down situations, especially if they're 3rd and 4+ to go. I think we need to make many 1st downs on the 1st 2 downs. If not, then our offense is being contained, which may suggest our line is not winning by more than 50%.

In the red zone, we need to continue with our touchdown conversion percentage, which I believe is high????right? cannot settle for field goals. It must be like Texas, 3 TD's, 1 FG. I pray!

I was in Chicago today. Met with a Badger fan. His 1st comment is that he expects us to play Michigan again for the Nat'l title. Don't know what to make of that. That's scary. Any speculations? I know, we have Indiana this week, and it wont be easy.

 

[rocketman]

I think this year's defense can be considered excellent only after the last game. I realize the statistics so far suggest they are better than last year's. But I don't accept that unless they maintain these numbers in every game this year. And we're not yet done. If they continue, as much as I loved the style and effectiveness of last year's defense, I will finally surrender to this year's defense. Just keep thinking they're gonna blow up one game. It's a stupid thought based solely on the amount of yardage we've given up.

There's a saying I learned in a statistics course: "There are lies, damned lies, and statistics"

On converting on 3rd downs: I certainly hope we don't have too many 3rd down situations, especially if they're 3rd and 4+ to go. I think we need to make many 1st downs on the 1st 2 downs. If not, then our offense is being contained, which may suggest our line is not winning by more than 50%.

In the red zone, we need to continue with our touchdown conversion percentage, which I believe is high????right? cannot settle for field goals. It must be like Texas, 3 TD's, 1 FG. I pray!

I was in Chicago today. Met with a Badger fan. His 1st comment is that he expects us to play Michigan again for the Nat'l title. Don't know what to make of that. That's scary. Any speculations? I know, we have Indiana this week, and it wont be easy.

It's going to be tough for them to "blow a game" in the next couple weeks considering the offenses we're going to face are pretty lackluster. Weren't you a little impressed with the way we stopped the run against MSU? Yeah, the playcalling matched the smarts of their coach, but regardless, we stuffed the run on them. Stats may be lies but the defense has yet to put us in a position where we might lose.

 

[osugrad21]

With most college football observers anticipating a Nov. 18 matchup of No. 1 Ohio State and No. 2 Michigan, Penn State defensive end Tim Shaw is willing to provide a scouting report. "In my opinion, I would say Michigan is better than Ohio State or Notre Dame," Shaw told the Centre Daily Times. "I think Michigan's offense is better than Ohio State's and their defense compares with Ohio State's."


Link

 

[NFBuck]

With most college football observers anticipating a Nov. 18 matchup of No. 1 Ohio State and No. 2 Michigan, Penn State defensive end Tim Shaw is willing to provide a scouting report. "In my opinion, I would say Michigan is better than Ohio State or Notre Dame," Shaw told the Centre Daily Times. "I think Michigan's offense is better than Ohio State's and their defense compares with Ohio State's."


Link

Yeah, well, that's just like...his opinion man.:)

 

[smartone]

You'd better believe I was impressed with the defense v. Mich. State, especially after the early fumble and the 16 yard sack. I am not saying they're not awesome. Just saying they need to keep it up till the season ends. Look what happened to Georgia, they had great defensive stats till they crumbled v. Tennessee. Again, not saying we'll do that. Just want to see us finish out the way we are without a hiccup. Obviously, Michigan will be the test. Maybe it's because we lost 9 starters that AT THIS POINT, I have more confidence in last years' defense. I KNEW they would not break, EVER (well 'xcept for 1 VY - Swede? pass which was an amazing catch-he couldnt have been better covered)

On the Penn State comments: When they interviewed paterno after Michigan, although he didn't say Michigan is better than us, I felt he made it clear that Michigan was the best team they have faced this year. Would a coach KNOW that after playing the 2 teams - I wonder??

 

[DaddyBigBucks]

With most college football observers anticipating a Nov. 18 matchup of No. 1 Ohio State and No. 2 Michigan, Penn State defensive end Tim Shaw is willing to provide a scouting report. "In my opinion, I would say Michigan is better than Ohio State or Notre Dame," Shaw told the Centre Daily Times. "I think Michigan's offense is better than Ohio State's and their defense compares with Ohio State's."


Link

Based on what Tim Shaw saw how could you disagree?

He played the Buckeyes on what was arguably their worst performance of the year in horrible conditions. It's just a hunch, but I doubt that OSU will have their worst performance of the year on November 18th.

 

[NFBuck]

Half of our PSU game was played in a virtual monsoon as well which slowed up our offense. They had a hard time getting into a rhthm as a result of that. I think they'd be singing a different tune had we played in more favorable conditions.

**DaddyBigBucks beat me to it **

 

[smartone]

Hey, I've been a Buckeye nut since 1974. How can I be a newbie? Will I get alzheimer's before I'm not a newbie?:)

 

[notfadeaway]

Yeah, well, that's just like...his opinion man.:)

Or, that could just be the stress talking man...he is being very un-dude

 

[BuckeyeGanoosh]

In no way, shape, or form has Notre Dame impressed me this year. The comeback/collapse in the MSU game will allow some credit, but give me a break. John L. seriously has the knack to blow the few games where his offense gels off the gun and gives him a cushion, and they looked MUCH weaker than a Northern Illinois team that lost to OHIO U (American Western University). I've yet to see dominance in Notre Dame, and they seemed to be a more consistent unit last season particularly on the ground. Tsun whipped 'em, and well, they should have. The buckeyes would walk up and down the field on these guys, and last year's fiesta bowl is evidence of that dominance.

To call scum's offense better than the bucks is just plain laughable imho. I've watched both.
Henne does not have the consistency or the poise that Troy Smith displays week in, week out, and he's going to throw at least two interceptions against our pick-happy defense. Tsun will NOT play us again on the eighth of January, mark your calenders.

 

[Steve19]

In answer to a poster's rant about SSI getting the 26-119 rankings wrong, Stewart Mandel says that he a team of monkeys actually do those rankings for his column http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/writers/stewart_mandel/10/18/mandel.bag/2.html

I have sent the following post to his mailbag. We'll see if it gets posted:

Sorry, Stew, but passing off the 26-119 ranking errors onto those poor monkeys is not acceptable. Monkeys have a right to dignity just like anyone else and hold respectable positions in society. For instance, the University of Michigan has employed one as a head coach for years.

 

[osugrad21]

Link

Big Two (Again) --
No, Woody and Bo aren't still in charge but it is flashback time for the Big Ten.
Ohio State and Michigan are 1-2 in The Associated Press poll for the first time since Hayes and Schembechler were prowling and growling on the sidelines in 1976.
"I don't have a lot of time to worry about other teams right now," Ohio State WR Brian Hartline said. "But yeah, we take notice (of Michigan). It's going to be interesting. There's a lot of possible outcomes at the end of this year. It's going to be kind of nice to maybe have it all ending up in the 'Shoe this year."
Michigan plays at the Horseshoe on Nov. 18. The bidding for a single ticket on eBay starts at around $750.

 

[osugrad21]

Link


Michigan lurks in background for Buckeyes
By JON SPENCER
For The Advocate

COLUMBUS -- They've been told not to look, but how do you ignore the elephant with the maize and blue hide clomping about the room?
That darn Michigan pachyderm is everywhere. It's on film when Ohio State players scout their next opponent. It's in the newspaper, noisily gaining ground on the Buckeyes in the polls. It's stalking reporters, nudging them to ask about the only football game anybody really cares about.
"It's almost impossible not to notice," OSU defensive end Jay Richardson said. "You see the rankings and go, 'Wow, that's huge.' It's in the back of everybody's brain."
Ohio State, the consensus No. 1 all season, doesn't have to look hard to find Michigan right behind it at No. 2 in this week's Associated Press and Harris polls. The Wolverines are No. 3 in the USA Today coaches poll and the all-important Bowl Championship Series rankings behind the Buckeyes and USC.You can almost smell couches burning near the OSU campus as anticipation builds toward the Nov. 18 collision between the two superpowers. Only twice (1970 and 1973) since the rivalry moved to the final game of the regular season in 1935 have both schools been unbeaten. The game has never featured a No. 1 vs. No. 2 showdown.
Barring a calamity of Clarett-like proportions, the winner will play for the national championship in Glendale, Ariz., on Jan. 8.
"Of course we take notice," receiver Brian Hartline said. "We're still fans of the game and we see things like (the rankings).
"Everybody comes to Ohio State to play these type of games. In order to play a game like that we still have to do what we need to do. If we're still No. 1 and No. 2 at the end of the season, it will be the game it's supposed to be. In order to do that, we've got to win the rest of our games."
Hartline was referring to four weeks of warmup acts, during which neither team should break much of a sweat. Ohio State plays Indiana, Minnesota, Illinois and Northwestern (a combined 3-10 in the Big Ten), while Michigan faces Iowa, Northwestern and Ball State before visiting Indiana in its final tuneup.
Little wonder the temptation to look ahead is so tantalizing.
"Woody always had Michigan Monday," said offensive tackle Kirk Barton, alluding to how coaching legend Woody Hayes would set aside one day each week to prepare for the Wolverines, "and it seems like anytime Michigan plays a team before us, that's one of the first tapes we watch."
Barton is aware of all the macho posturing from fans, ex-players and maybe even teammates who want to see injured Michigan receiver Mario Manningham in uniform and the Wolverines at full strength when they invade Ohio Stadium.
But Barton is already looking for any edge he can get.
"I think you'd have to be an idiot to say you want Manningham back on the field," he said of the touchdown machine and Ohio defector. "I remember when he was a sophomore at Warren Harding. He came off the JV team and just tore up Massillon Washington. I'm from Massillon Perry and I don't like the Tigers at all, and he just tore them up.
"They couldn't scout him because he was playing JV the week before. He returned two kickoffs and a punt for touchdowns. It was unbelievable ... and then he goes to Michigan, of course."
Ohio State ranks first in the Big Ten in scoring defense (9.0 ppg), turnover margin (plus-10) and pass efficiency and is second in pass defense efficiency and scoring offense (33.6 ppg). Michigan is first nationally in rushing defense (32.6 ypg) and second in the Big Ten in pass efficiency, turnover margin (plus-nine) and total defense.
Fans will dissect those statistics with surgical precision for the next four weeks, which is fine with OSU coach Jim Tressel as long as his players keep their focus on the operating table each Saturday.
"The suggestion we gave the players is the same suggestion we gave them at the beginning of the season: focus on what's going on this second," Tressel said. "The other suggestion is to go study more film instead of reading what's being written."