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Its early but some familiar trends are starting to resurface

I don't think "picking" a QB is going to suddenly make us better and I don't think one is better than the other. They both played below expectations last night and they both were very lucky they did not play further below expectations even more; fumbles, should-have-been-picks-and-weren't, overthrows, missed reads, etc. Let's face it, our QB position is a weakness. And because they are both bad, JT can't decide who plays further below expectations than the other. I will say this in their defense, the offensive scheme is not giving them enough opportunities to get better.

I do think we need a FB in there ahead of Pittman to see what he can do. Also, the wide runs from the spread were nice gains as well. Also, we need a more vertical look to our offense as well. Otherwise, I see more shootouts in the future.
 
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UGABuck said:
I really don't think we should start thinking next week is a cake walk. Our QB position is weak, our running game is suspect due to overal offensive scheme and our DL has vanished.

Then we have a head coach who is incapable of putting teams away. Yes, you can make the argument that's his "style" but to me it's only flirting with disaster; see last night, Purdue (02), Wisky (03), NCST, Cinci, etc.

As far as blowing through the B10, let's take it one game at a time. Like Jax, I see a 5 year trend in the making wrt our offense. This spans great personnel...NFL talent to be exact. I would like to see Tressel step up the way he asks his teams to step up.
I see another 5 year trend much different than the offensive yards type stats that talk of. Yes In a fantasy league that is important,but in real games remember the W/L stat?

In four seasons at Ohio State 3-1 against Michigan, 3-1 in bowl games, 40-11 record before this season. Oh by the way he led the buckeyes to a 19-game winning streak and a national Championship. Yea maybe he should step it up.

Jax I'll give some credit since you at least made some very good points and a good post . UGABuck I would expect better of you. After all you usually have some very good posts yourself. I think its frustration since sometimes we would all like to see more of a Florida style offence, but, It really is defences that win Championships.
 
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tru2OSU said:
Jax I'll give some credit since you at least made some very good points and a good post . UGABuck I would expect better of you. After all you usually have some very good posts yourself. I think its frustration since sometimes we would all like to see more of a Florida style offence, but, It really is defences that win Championships.


I do not expect a UF offense.

True, I am frustrated. I suppose it's easy for me to look at the game and pick the negatives but I look at it as constructive criticism. For example, I expect the kicker to play like Huston played last night. A 50 yarder would have exceeded my expectations. I expect SA to play like he did last night..he is super. I expected AJ and Carp to play like they did last night...that's what AA 1st rounders do. I expected our O line to play like they did last night, they are good. Save Datish's performance, I think he contributed to the loss. I like Trapasso's effort but I expect that from an OSU punter.

The point I am trying to make is this, you are on scholarship to a football factory where we expect you to play your position, exceed expectations on occasion and at the very least don't deliver below expectations. In that regard, I believe the following positions delivered below expectations:

QB. I don't think I need to explain that.
DB. I understand the zone, but we were late reacting to VY's throws.
DL. No push whatsoever.

KR/PR. Ginn was fast but his vision cost us yards. SA was great.

Coaching: Poor offensive scheming. Did not react to the game. Great defensive adjustments but it took 10pts to do it.

As far as trends are concerned. I think they are a valid tool to measure our team's performance. I agree the bottom line is wins and losses. However, I am not satisfied with losses and particuarly not satisified with losses if we don't learn from them. For example, "TresselBall". I know it's hard to really define and we thought based on last weeks performance it was over. However, any time you play a game so close to the vest against a team as talented as Texas you are bound lose that close game. So why not make a change and aim to score as many points as possible against a team like this. We know that a FG or TD would have likely made the difference in this game. Another example, Tresselbal puts a ton of pressure on our QB position. Unfortunately we don't have the personnel to handle this pressure on a regular basis. They are capable of moments or a game on occasion but not a seasons worth of it. So let's consider that. I won't even get started on the tremendous pressure Tresselball places on a defense and DBs in general.

I will grant you that JT made adjustments last year and implemented a spread offense of some sorts this year. But it disappeared last night once the pressure started to build. I like what we have done with our O line, it is much improved thanks to Peterson. I simply think we now need to examine our offensive scheme and playcalling. We have absorbed changes in our defense coaching our O line coaching and now I think we should do the same for our Offense Coordination. And the reason I say this is because a five year trend is a large enough snapshot to give us a good indication of our tendencies. I am not suggesting anyone be fired or benched but a rationale selfcritical look at what is not working with the idea that we should make it better.
 
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UGABuck said:
I do not expect a UF offense.

True, I am frustrated. I suppose it's easy for me to look at the game and pick the negatives but I look at it as constructive criticism. For example, I expect the kicker to play like Huston played last night. A 50 yarder would have exceeded my expectations. I expect SA to play like he did last night..he is super. I expected AJ and Carp to play like they did last night...that's what AA 1st rounders do. I expected our O line to play like they did last night, they are good. Save Datish's performance, I think he contributed to the loss. I like Trapasso's effort but I expect that from an OSU punter.

The point I am trying to make is this, you are on scholarship to a football factory where we expect you to play your position, exceed expectations on occasion and at the very least don't deliver below expectations. In that regard, I believe the following positions delivered below expectations:

QB. I don't think I need to explain that.
DB. I understand the zone, but we were late reacting to VY's throws.
DL. No push whatsoever.

KR/PR. Ginn was fast but his vision cost us yards. SA was great.

Coaching: Poor offensive scheming. Did not react to the game. Great defensive adjustments but it took 10pts to do it.

As far as trends are concerned. I think they are a valid tool to measure our team's performance. I agree the bottom line is wins and losses. However, I am not satisfied with losses and particuarly not satisified with losses if we don't learn from them. For example, "TresselBall". I know it's hard to really define and we thought based on last weeks performance it was over. However, any time you play a game so close to the vest against a team as talented as Texas you are bound lose that close game. So why not make a change and aim to score as many points as possible against a team like this. We know that a FG or TD would have likely made the difference in this game. Another example, Tresselbal puts a ton of pressure on our QB position. Unfortunately we don't have the personnel to handle this pressure on a regular basis. They are capable of moments or a game on occasion but not a seasons worth of it. So let's consider that. I won't even get started on the tremendous pressure Tresselball places on a defense and DBs in general.

I will grant you that JT made adjustments last year and implemented a spread offense of some sorts this year. But it disappeared last night once the pressure started to build. I like what we have done with our O line, it is much improved thanks to Peterson. I simply think we now need to examine our offensive scheme and playcalling. We have absorbed changes in our defense coaching our O line coaching and now I think we should do the same for our Offense Coordination. And the reason I say this is because a five year trend is a large enough snapshot to give us a good indication of our tendencies. I am not suggesting anyone be fired or benched but a rationale selfcritical look at what is not working with the idea that we should make it better.
I can relate to your rationale here, and admit that the offensive schemes were not always to my liking either. I did see a good amount of confidence on offense though, and a good amount of mistakes, and finally a really good defense by the horns that contributed to our offensive ineffectiveness. Looking back at some highlights of last nights game, The longhorns have got my respect, their just plain good, but also I see where we had chances to win that game and we also could have lost by a lot more. :osu:
 
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The most disturbing trend that resurfaced yesterday was the Return of TressellBall. What happened to the newfound offensive philosophy of the last half-season? We claim to now be a spread/option team but we only lined up in those formations - other than a few plays we didn't consistently call and execute the plays that accompany those offensive philosophies. Which begs the question: What is our offensive identity?

Why weren't there any gambles/trick plays? Big games are the most opportune time to bust them out and catch the opposition on their heels, as Pete Carroll and Bob Stoops have done so well the last few years. How about simple end-arounds or reverses? Fake punts/field goals? This was a classic play it safe and "Play Not To Lose" game.

We have a dominant defense and kicking game, but we also have some of the most explosive offensive players we've had in the last 2+ years, so why not use them? We have Ted Ginn...one of the most explosive players in all of college football, and we didn't get him involved enough. Reminded me of the Wisconsin game last year where TG ran back a punt for a TD but bobbled the next punt, after which JT pulled him from the game. With a player like that you live with the mistakes because unlike 99% of other players out there, he can atone for his mistakes with an other-worldly play.

In spite of all that we almost won the game, but it could have been a lot easier with a little more belief in our players. I don't think our coaches trust them enough...let them go out there and make plays. Let them screw up and learn - these are elite athletes and eventually they will make the plays.
 
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ScarletArrow said:
My dad and I were saying the same thing...I think we've only gone vertical 4 times all year.


- Holmes TD vs. UT
- Holmes vs. UT (overthrown by Zwick)
.
this really burns me up too. there may have been times when a long pass was the play and receivers were covered but...both of these attempts vs UT should have lead to scores. what is wrong with going vertical on 3rd and nine. either we connect, we get an interference call, or least likely an interception but we are gonna punt anyways...i just dont get not using our speedy receivers.
 
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Oh8ch said:
I don't think it is fair to take an average over two games when one was against a D like Texas and take that is an indicator.

I do agree that JT will continue to call plays conservatively when he thinks he can manage the game via punt exchanges and Defense no matter what offensive weapons we have.

I also do not believe we have proven we have a running game. But good pitching stops good hitting and not many folks are going to run against Texas this year.

Oh8ch, I thought we ran the ball very well against Texas, when we called real running plays. (i.e. not a QB draw every other play once you cross their 40).
I wish we would have strapped up and taken them on a little more.
It will be interesting to see Jeff Amey's breakdown on O-Zone this week to see how effective some plays were. I'm very surprised Schnittker didn't get 10 or so carries - especially once we were in the lead.
 
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Oh8ch, I thought we ran the ball very well against Texas, when we called real running plays.

Agree. Let me clarify my position.

I think we have proven we have a pretty good running back - best since MC left. But Pittman was the only running back who was effective against Miami and the only running back who touched the ball against Texas.

IMO having a good running game means your OL can blow holes and any competent back can get yards on a fairly consistent basis.

I think I posted this somewhere else as well, but of Pittman's 17 carries last night 8 were for 2 yards or less (actually 7 were for one or less). That is not consistent enough to make a D respect your running game.

All that said, this was Texas and they are very hard to run against. I think we do have a running game and that Wells and perhaps even Haw will join Pittman in getting a solud YPC. But we haven't proven that yet.
 
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scarletngrey77 said:
zwicks a good guy, hes never done anything wrong off the field, and has even refused to transfer because he loves ohio state, but troy smith makes the offense even more dangerous.
more dangerous to who? i counted a lot of potential turovers last night.
i think he was more dangerous to Ohio State than he was to Texas... how many times did he fumble? how many times did he throw the ball straight to a defender?

It really is defences that win Championships.
not when your offense can't score.
 
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If you're looking at offensive yards for the Texas game, you're looking at the wrong stat.

When your average starting field position is damn near midfield because of turnovers and poor kick return coverage by your opponent - your total offensive yardage is gonna look pretty lame. The stat that this thread was based on is not skewed because of a small sample - it's skewed because of the starting field position.

From what I've seen the Buckeyes haven't had much of a problem moving the ball between the twenty yard lines. What is disturbing is this team's inability to turn that starting field postion into touchdowns instead of FGs, and their inability to finish drives when they reach the red zone. That's something that's been missing (sad to admit) since Clarett got booted.
 
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When your average starting field position is damn near midfield because of turnovers and poor kick return coverage by your opponent - your total offensive yardage is gonna look pretty lame. The stat that this thread was based on is not skewed because of a small sample - it's skewed because of the starting field position.
Good point.

The dual QB thing has been beaten to death, but I do agree with picking one and sticking with him until he gives you a good reason not to. Too much switching within a game can cause more trouble than good- just ask John Cooper.

Our D is obviously going to kick ass again this year, and any team in the Big Ten who thinks they're goin to come in and hang a bunch of points on us will be very disappointed- it ain't going to happen.

As far as big blowouts and point totals, we should all know by now that Tressel doesn't coach that way. We are so good that there will be teams that we can't help blowing out, but for the most part he will coach the team to do what it takes to win without taking too much risk. Tressel has pretty much played that way for 4 years now, and it's gotten our Buckeyes 3 wins over scUM, a National Championship, and a win percentage of about 70%.

I love blowouts- I'd love to see more of them, and I'd love to see us "open up the offense" and go for broke. That may happen once Tressel gets comfortable enough with everyone involved so he doesn't feel like it's too risky. Until then, I'll be happy beating everyone in the Big Ten and I'll savor each big play we see.
 
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