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Joe Torre (official thread)

jwinslow;628990; said:
So most ARod coverage is not to point out how often he chokes in big moments? One SI article doesn't change that, imo.

Well that's your opinion and you're entitled to it. But most of the coverage, especially before he got to NY, was that he "might very well be" (whatever the hell that means, but people say it a lot) the best SS ever. The recent coverage of him choking this year doesn't change that to me, no.
 
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`Deeply disappointed' Steinbrenner labels Yankees `sad failure'

NEW YORK (AP) -- Yankees owner George Steinbrenner said he was "deeply disappointed" at his team's elimination in the first round of the AL playoffs, calling it a "sad failure."

New York was heavily favored in its series against the Detroit Tigers and won Tuesday's opener 8-4. The Tigers then won 4-3 at Yankee Stadium on Thursday, and swept two games in Detroit, 6-0 Friday and 8-3 Saturday.

I am deeply disappointed at our being eliminated so early in the playoffs," Steinbrenner said in a statement issued Sunday by spokesman Howard Rubenstein. "This result is absolutely not acceptable to me nor to our great and loyal Yankee fans. I want to congratulate the Detroit Tigers organization and wish them well. Rest assured, we will go back to work immediately and try to right this sad failure and provide a championship for the Yankees, as is our goal every year."
Rubenstein said he spoke with Steinbrenner onSunday. "Clearly he was upset," he said.

Rubenstein said Steinbrenner was not going to comment on a report in the New York Daily News that manager Joe Torre likely will be fired and replaced by Lou Piniella.
 
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Thump;629268; said:
Rubenstein said Steinbrenner was not going to comment on a report in the New York Daily News that manager Joe Torre likely will be fired and replaced by Lou Piniella.

I have heard that if they let Torre go which it seems like they will, then it will be between Pinella and Girardi to manage the team.
 
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Note to ESPN:

[RANT]

FUCK THE YANKEES!!!

Try to talk just a little bit about the handful of teams that are still playing baseball this year.

[/RANT]

I feel a little better now. Carry on.
 
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Yankees feeling spent

By Bob Ryan, Globe Columnist | October 10, 2006

The Boss is embarrassed.

He doesn't mind spending upward of a billion dollars on personnel in just six years if he wins. He doesn't care if people deride him for being a fiscal bully if he wins. He just wants to win.

But when you spend and spend and spend and don't win, your enemies laugh. That's embarrassing.

George Steinbrenner is 76 years old, and the whispers are that he is, for lack of a better description, Not The Man He Used To Be. In other words, he is impatient to win again.

His team last won in 2000, a year in which the Yankees entered the playoffs with a mere 87 victories. That was a close call. So The Boss has spent money -- a whole lot of money -- on ballplayers he and his advisers believed would ensure that the Yankees occupy what The Boss believes to be their rightful place as the last team standing, year after year after year. Mike Mussina. Jason Giambi. Hideki Matsui. Alex Rodriguez. Gary Sheffield. Carl Pavano. Randy Johnson. Johnny Damon. Bobby Abreu. Kevin Brown. All were given eight figures a year. And then there were the extensions for Derek Jeter, Bernie Williams, Jorge Posada, and Mariano Rivera, four more players who took home eight figures a year.

But these players have brought The Boss nothing but frustration and embarrassment. His teams have twice lost postseason series to teams that were not even in existence when The Boss and his partners bought the team. His teams have twice lost to Angels squads with rosters on which The Boss would have great difficulty naming 10 players. His team lost in record-breaking and humiliating fashion to its archrival. And now his team has lost three straight to a Detroit team loaded with players responsible for losing 119 games three short years ago.

So The Boss is asking, ``How can this be?" and is reportedly asking for an important head to be placed on a platter and brought to his office.

There is a problem in associating money with true prowess. The only time money is indisputably important is on the first and 15th of the month when it finds its way to some lucky recipient. But in sports, money is spent in one of two ways. It is spent for past services rendered or it is spent on future expectations. No one in professional team sports gets paid by the day. It's not golf. That being the case, it is very easy to overpay.

It would have been interesting to evaluate the Yankees and Tigers strictly on the basis of what our eyes told us after watching them perform, rather than on the basis of what we know they make. Curtis Granderson or Johnny Damon in center? That would have been a pretty easy call. Granderson was a marvel. But Damon makes 40 times what Granderson does, give or take a Benjamin. Sean Casey or the Giambi/Sheffield combo? Advantage, Detroit. Casey is a nice ballplayer, but he is playing for his third team in a year, and he has never approached the Giambi/Sheffield earning level. But he came up pretty big in the biggest series of his life, didn't he?

Still, it isn't about player comparisons. The Yankee-Detroit series was about two things. It was about simply playing the game correctly, and it was about pitching. And for all the money The Boss spent, it appears he needed to spend a bit more for a couple of pitchers who might have gotten the job done.

All other things equal, had the Yankees played the Tigers to a standoff in other areas, they were fated to lose this series because the clear Detroit edge was in pitching.

Randy Johnson is a first-ballot Hall of Famer who will retire as one of the five best lefthanders that ever played the game (Warren Spahn, Sandy Koufax, Lefty Grove, and Whitey Ford being the other four). He earned $15.7 million this year, despite the fact he is now an erratic back-of-the-rotation starter. He will turn 44 next September and he will be making $17 million while being even less effective than he was this year, when his ERA (exactly 5.00) was far more reflective of the way he pitched than his win total (17). He may be getting $15.7 million en route to $17 million, but that's because of what he was, not what he is. He is now stupendously overpaid.

If you were George Steinbrenner, Brian Cashman, or Joe Torre, whom would you take for your 2007 rotation? Randy Johnson or Justin Verlander? Randy Johnson or Jeremy Bonderman? I might even say, just to make a point, Randy Johnson or Kenny Rogers?

Detroit had both the great young arms (including set-up man extraordinaire Joel Zumaya, the kid I like to call ``WBZ" because he throws 103) and the more effective older ones. I mean, who was that guy pretending to be Kenny Rogers? And I'm sure you knew when Todd Jones left here three years ago he would be saving 37 games for a team on the verge of winning a pennant. Good for him. Please accept my word for it that Todd Jones is one guy you wouldn't mind seeing make $15.7 million.

The 2006 ALCS will feature two cost-effective teams that are growing up together. The Tigers and A's also have deep, talented pitching staffs. There's a lesson in there somewhere.

Having the wherewithal to overspend for players is not necessarily a good thing. That's how you wind up with injury-prone mercenaries such as Randy Johnson and Gary Sheffield, as opposed to younger, healthier, and hungrier players. A key older free agent signee who really is the right man in the right place at the right time (i.e. Curt Schilling), well, that's what everyone wants to find. There just aren't many of them. This is hardly an original thought, but the Yankees were better off when they had players such as Paul O'Neill and Tino Martinez, guys just below the star level who came to play without personal agendas and bloated self-images.

You know when the Yankees were at their best this year? It was when they had scrappy players such as Melky Cabrera and Andy Phillips in the lineup. The former is a young star in the making and the latter is a classic overachieving glue guy. On the subject of star power, less is unquestionably more. Ladies and gentlemen, I give you Bill Mueller.

I don't think The Boss has ever bought into this. The Boss has always believed that if you just pile star after star on top of each other, good things will happen.

It doesn't work that way. The only way anyone will ever have to worry about a 27th flag flying atop Yankee Stadium is if they get their pitching in order and then find themselves a few worker bees. That's how they won four out of five. And someone should tell The Boss that firing Joe Torre won't accomplish either of those things.

Bob Ryan is a Globe columnist. His e-mail is [email protected].
dingbat_story_end_icon.gif




http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/articles/2006/10/10/yankees_feeling_spent/
 
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Steinbrenner Takes Another Day to Decide on Torre

By TYLER KEPNER

If George Steinbrenner had acted on his impulse after the Yankees? swift playoff exit Saturday, Joe Torre would already be a former Yankees manager. But Steinbrenner took a second day to contemplate Torre?s fate, which could only be an encouraging sign for Torre.

It does not mean Torre will return for his 12th season as Yankees manager. But the feeling around the organization yesterday was that Steinbrenner alone would make the decision, and he said he was not sure what he would do.

?I have not made up my mind yet,? Steinbrenner told reporters after lunch at the restaurant of the Loews Regency Hotel in Midtown Manhattan. Steinbrenner, the Yankees? principal owner, returned to Tampa, Fla., later in the day.

General Manager Brian Cashman said he wanted to retain Torre, who is entering the final year of his contract but has not led the Yankees to a championship since 2000. Others in the organization, still reeling from the American League division series loss to the Detroit Tigers, have doubts about whether Torre should stay.

Steinbrenner has long been enamored with Lou Piniella, a former player, general manager and manager for the Yankees. But yesterday, Steinbrenner was still seeking answers from his executives about what went wrong in the playoffs.

That has been a pastime for Steinbrenner the last six seasons after a postseason loss. But Torre?s position has never been more vulnerable, and rarely have such obvious possible successors ? including Piniella and Joe Girardi ? been available.

Torre has not appeared at Yankee Stadium since the loss, and Cashman has not returned phone calls. But various players and coaches have supported Torre, including Alex Rodriguez, the embattled third baseman.

Rodriguez and his wife, Cynthia, had lunch yesterday at the same time as Steinbrenner, on the same block, one building away. Rodriguez signed autographs for fans but declined to answer questions.

Later, Rodriguez?s agent, Scott Boras, said Rodriguez backed Torre.

?Alex is very supportive of Joe Torre and enjoys playing for him,? Boras said in a telephone interview. ?I think he views what happened this postseason as one where some great starting pitchers beat a very good offense. From his perspective, that had nothing to do with Joe Torre.?

Torre dropped Rodriguez to eighth in the batting order for the fourth and final game of the series against Detroit. Rodriguez, who finished the series 1 for 14, had not batted that far down in a lineup in more than 10 years.

Torre?s greatest strength may be communicating with his players, yet he did not consult Rodriguez or the team about the move. Gary Sheffield, who was benched for Game 3, told USA Today that the lineup startled the team.

?I think that affected the morale and psyche of the entire team, not just A-Rod,? Sheffield said. ?I?m not making any excuses, but everyone was wondering what was going on. It made it a real weird day. You would like to be treated with a little respect, I don?t care who you play for. We were worrying about all of that stuff, and we still had a game to play.?

Steinbrenner has surely considered what impact changing managers would have on Rodriguez, who seems more likely to stay with the Yankees than not.

Although other teams would probably be interested in trading for Rodriguez, he has shown no willingness to waive his no-trade clause, and the Yankees said they had not explored any deals.

Rodriguez played seven seasons under Piniella in Seattle and said he had great respect for him. Yet replacing Torre with a manager well known to Rodriguez could disrupt the chemistry in the clubhouse, where Rodriguez already has an uneasy relationship with the team?s captain, Derek Jeter.

Despite their different personalities, Rodriguez and Jeter have coexisted for three seasons and helped lead the Yankees to three division titles. Torre has won nine in a row, cultivating a professional and winning atmosphere.

?To deal with a lot of superstars is hard,? said the reserve infielder Miguel Cairo, who packed his belongings at Yankee Stadium yesterday. ?For him, it?s easy. It?s a plus when you have a manager like that, who knows how to do it.?

Starter Jaret Wright said he would be sad to see Torre leave, and reliever Ron Villone called Torre a class act and a great manager. When Steinbrenner considers changes to the team, Villone said, he should not start with Torre.

?You can look at the bullpen, you can look at the lineup, you can look at the bench,? Villone said. ?I?d rather look there first than look at who?s sitting on the bench.?

Piniella is a candidate for several manager openings. Because his name has been publicly connected to the Yankees, Steinbrenner may be hoping that Piniella waits for him to make up his mind about Torre before accepting another job.
Piniella is in Oakland working as a broadcaster for the American League Championship Series. He told reporters there that he had not heard from Steinbrenner.

?We?ve always been friendly,? Piniella said. ?No, we haven?t talked at all about that. In fact, I haven?t seen Mr. Steinbrenner in 10 months. Talk to my agent about these things.?

He added: ?Look, I don?t want to get into that subject. It?s not right. I respect the situation too much for me to comment on anything else.?

Commissioner Bud Selig forbids teams from announcing major moves while postseason series are going on, preferring to keep fans focused on the games.

But Steinbrenner has long enjoyed upstaging the Mets, as he did during the 1988 playoffs, when he fired Piniella as manager and hired Dallas Green. That was the last time the Mets played in the postseason while the Yankees did not. The last time, that is, until now.

INSIDE PITCH
Randy Johnson plans to see Dr. Robert Watkins, who performed his back surgery in 1996, to determine if he needs back surgery again, said Johnson?s agent, Barry Meister. Surgery would likely require three months of rehabilitation. ?He just wants to make sure he?s ready in spring training and has the best chance at not having his season interrupted next year,? Meister said.

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/10/10/s...=th&adxnnlx=1160492698-kheXC33b1ExfMf7BhIe0Pw
 
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Much ado about nothing

Torre to stay on.


Torre remaining as manager of YankeesBy RONALD BLUM, AP Baseball Writer
October 10, 2006

NEW YORK (AP) -- Joe Torre will remain as manager of the New York Yankees, finally getting the word from owner George Steinbrenner after the team's surprise elimination from the playoffs last weekend.
Torre spoke with Steinbrenner on the telephone Tuesday, shortly before he walked into the interview room at Yankee Stadium and made the announcement. "He gave me his support," Torre said. "I'm just pleased I'm able to stay
on and do this."
Torre didn't go into detail about his conversations with Steinbrenner.

But Steinbrenner, in a statement issued through spokesman Howard Rubenstein, said:
"I spoke to Joe Torre today and I told him: `You're back for the year. I expect a great deal from you and the entire team. I have high expectations, and I want to see enthusiasm, a fighting spirit and a team that works together. Responsibility is yours, Joe, and all of the Yankees.'
"Yes, I am deeply disappointed about our loss this year," Steinbrenner added. "We have to do better, and I deeply want a championship. It's about time."
Torre said he also spoke to Steinbrenner on Monday "for probably 15, 20 minutes, and we discussed a lot of things: the team, what we do from here and things like that."
The Daily News reported Sunday that Steinbrenner was expected to fire Torre after the Yankees were eliminated by the Detroit Tigers, the Yankees' second straight elimination in the first round of the AL playoffs. The paper said the likely replacement would be Lou Piniella, who served two terms as Yankees manager in the 1980s. On Tuesday, the New York Post said on its cover that Torre's job was safe.
Torre didn't make any public statements Sunday or Monday as camera crews camped outside his home in suburban Westchester.
"I thought I had the cure for cancer or something," Torre said.
While the Yankees won four World Series titles in Torre's first five seasons, they haven't won any since 2000, angering the demanding Steinbrenner. They haven't even reached the World Series since 2000.
"He requires a lot. He expects a lot. We know that," Torre said. "You can't pick and choose the parts you like about working for George Steinbrenner. You have to understand the whole package. He requires us to be the best team out there and to be able to perform like it."
Torre, hired after the 1995 season, has one year remaining on his contract. He said he wasn't sure whether he wanted to manage beyond 2007.
Late in the season and during the playoffs, he made several controversial decisions. He moved right fielder Gary Sheffield to first base when he returned from wrist surgery, and put Hideki Matsui back in left in place of Melky Cabrera when Matsui came back from a broken wrist.
The most debated decision was when he dropped Alex Rodriguez, baseball's highest-paid player at $252 million, to the No. 8 spot in the batting order for Saturday's season-ending 8-3 loss.
Rodriguez was repeatedly booed at Yankee Stadium this season, his third with New York.
"I want to believe that, yes, as far as I'm concerned, Alex Rodriguez is one of the important pieces to this puzzle here," Torre said.
With 1,973 regular-season wins, Torre is 10th on the career list and third among active managers behind Tony La Russa of the St. Louis Cardinals (2,297) and Bobby Cox (2,171) of the Atlanta Braves.
Torre has the longest uninterrupted term for a Yankees manager since Casey Stengel held the job for 12 years from 1949-60. Under Torre, the Yankees have gone 1,079-699. He trails only Joe McCarthy (1,460) and Stengel (1,149) for victories among Yankees managers.
Updated on Tuesday
 
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ABJ

Joe Torre remains as manager of Yankees

RONALD BLUM

Associated Press

NEW YORK - Now Joe Torre has to lead the New York Yankees back to the World Series, as if he didn't know that already.
George Steinbrenner ended three days of speculation that followed his team's second straight first-round exit from the AL playoffs, telling Torre on Tuesday that he will be back for a 12th season.
Ever since Detroit eliminated the Yankees on Saturday, reports of Torre's imminent dismissal dominated New York media. When Steinbrenner left Monday to return to Tampa, Fla., he said he still hadn't made a decision.
Would he revert to his old ways, when he changed managers 20 times from 1973-95? Or would he stick with the revered Torre, who led the team to four World Series titles in his first five years but none in the six seasons since?
"Let's just say that he echoed support and commitment to having me go on in this job," Torre said. "I felt comfortable with the conversation."
Steinbrenner recounted the talk in a statement issued through spokesman Howard Rubenstein, saying he told Torre: "You're back for the year. I expect a great deal from you and the entire team. I have high expectations, and I want to see enthusiasm, a fighting spirit and a team that works together. Responsibility is yours, Joe, and all of the Yankees.
"Yes, I am deeply disappointed about our loss this year," Steinbrenner added. "We have to do better, and I deeply want a championship. It's about time."
Since Saturday's loss, Steinbrenner spent his time listening to the advice of his top executives. On Monday, Torre spoke with him about 15-to-20 minutes, and told him: "If you feel in your heart a change has to be made, go ahead and do it." After that phone call, Torre said he felt more confident he would keep his job.
All the while, camera crews camped outside Torre's home in suburban Westchester.
"I thought I had the cure for cancer or something," Torre said.
The most likely successor for the 66-year-old Torre was Lou Piniella, who served two terms as Yankees manager in the 1980s.
For two days, speculation about Torre's job ran nonstop. First he was out; then he was in.
"I didn't read the paper," Torre said. "But I know my sisters did and my brother did and wife did."
Torre has led the Yankees to 11 consecutive playoff berths and nine AL East titles in a row, finishing in a tie with the Mets for best regular-season record this year at 97-65. But despite having baseball's largest payroll by a wide margin, the Yankees haven't reached the World Series since 2003.
"When we go to spring training every year, we talk about getting to the World Series. We don't talk about having a good year, let's have a good record and all that stuff. It's getting to the World Series. So you know going in what the requirements are," Torre said. "He requires a lot. He expects a lot and we know that. You can't pick and choose the parts that you like about working for George Steinbrenner. You have to understand the whole package, and the whole package has been pretty damn good as far as I'm concerned for 11 years."
Yankees general manager Brian Cashman said team executives gave Steinbrenner their opinions on Torre. Steinbrenner informed them of his decision just before telling the manager his job was safe.
"I believe that he is the right man for this job right now at this point in time," Cashman said.
Some of Torre's players lent their support.
"Always in my mind, Joe is manager of the New York Yankees," Hideki Matsui said.
Derek Jeter's agent, Casey Close, said the Yankees captain was "thrilled by the news."
"Everybody knows the comfort level Derek has with Joe," Close said.
Piniella also backed Torre.
"I'm sorry he had to go through that rigamarole," he said. "There was no need for that."
Torre, hired after the 1995 season, nearly quit after last season, when his relationship with Steinbrenner deteriorated. But the two got along well this year and there was no evidence of interference by the owner.
Torre has one year remaining on his contract and is owed $7 million, the highest salary for a baseball manager. He isn't sure whether he wants to manage beyond 2007.
"When you work here, you have to understand that every year may be your last year," Torre said.
Late in the season and during the playoffs, he made several controversial decisions. He moved right fielder Gary Sheffield to first base when he returned from wrist surgery, and put Hideki Matsui back in left in place of Melky Cabrera when Matsui came back from a broken wrist.
His most debated move was to drop Alex Rodriguez, baseball's highest-paid player at $252 million and a two-time AL MVP, to the No. 8 spot in the batting order for the season-ending 8-3 loss to Detroit.
Rodriguez went 0-for-3, dropping to 1-for-14 in the series, but Torre said A-Rod "is one of the important pieces to this puzzle here" and Cashman said the Yankees didn't intend to trade him. Cashman doesn't think Rodriguez was made at Torre for being dropped in the order.
"If there is an issue with Alex, they've got to make it right," he said.
 
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Dispatch

Baseball notebook: Torre's run in Bronx likely over

Tuesday, October 9, 2007 3:46 AM







After 12 playoff appearances in 12 seasons, Joe Torre might have managed his final game for the New York Yankees when they were knocked out of the playoffs in a 6-4 loss to the Cleveland Indians last night.

Cont...
 
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Torre is definitely a classy guy, and agree with BB, he is good for baseball. What I think really needs to change on this team is the philosophy by Steinbrenner on how to put together a championship team. They need to blow this team up and get younger. Keep Jeter since he is the face of the team, keep Melky, Cano, Joba, Hughes and the other young guys with the high upside, but trade away or don't resign everyone else. Rebuild, retool, come back strong again in 2-3 years and I bet they have more success.
 
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Big Papa;954198; said:
Torre is definitely a classy guy, and agree with BB, he is good for baseball. What I think really needs to change on this team is the philosophy by Steinbrenner on how to put together a championship team. They need to blow this team up and get younger. Keep Jeter since he is the face of the team, keep Melky, Cano, Joba, Hughes and the other young guys with the high upside, but trade away or don't resign everyone else. Rebuild, retool, come back strong again in 2-3 years and I bet they have more success.
Sounds like a good idea idea Big papa. Any way they can get rid of Steinbrenner too?
 
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