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2018 tOSU Offense Discussion

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Jaxbuck said:
I think that's a bit drastic.

You give up a running QB then there are trade offs. Chief one being that the passer has to be able to turn the short passing game into an extension of the running game. It is to be expected, or at least should have been expected to some degree. The next 4 games of the schedule are the time to keep improving on that.

Worth noting however that it isn't like Sparty who can't run at all, against anyone. The OSU run game is just fine given the shift away from the QB run threat. If they want to go from very good to elite then they just need to keep perfecting those quick passes and screens.
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If the TEs are going to produce in the throw game and dont help us running the ball then whats the point?
 
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Jaxbuck said:
I think that's a bit drastic.

You give up a running QB then there are trade offs. Chief one being that the passer has to be able to turn the short passing game into an extension of the running game. It is to be expected, or at least should have been expected to some degree. The next 4 games of the schedule are the time to keep improving on that.

Worth noting however that it isn't like Sparty who can't run at all, against anyone. The OSU run game is just fine given the shift away from the QB run threat. If they want to go from very good to elite then they just need to keep perfecting those quick passes and screens.
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Totally. Watching those highlights of the screens is a thing of beauty. That and the short, accurate passing of Haskins makes them very dangerous. WRs and TEs just need to hold on (especially to slants and short ins) because going from gaining 8-10 yards to nothing is such a momentum killer.

They will hopefully keep adding screens or changing the way they present them in formations until it's just an extension of their base offense. BTW I'm always excited to see a breakdown by you Jax, so thanks for doing it.
 
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Jaxbuck said:
Sort of misleading.

Defenses have been playing a 1 high safety, take away the deep pass and stack the box vs run-make them stay patient and work their way down the field defense, for the better part of 5 years now.

These stats show me exactly what we know to be the case with our eyes. JT Barrett couldn't consistently do that (stay patient or be accurate enough with short passes to let them turn into big gains). he often was throwing into the coverage and often because it was 3rd and long. That is not exactly being "aggressive" in my book.

Haskins, so far, has shown that he will absolutely dissect a defense if they give him that same simple, easy to read, man coverage. His superior accuracy makes those type of completions more of a weapon because you have the athletes catching it in stride and doing damage. yards after completion would be a stat I'd like to see compared like the above if we ever could.

P.S.

Defensive coordinators are going to adjust soon. My guess is we see the same general pattern as when Dick LeBeau popularized zone blitzing to disrupt west coast offenses. Same principles apply; you can't just blitz a highly accurate passer and play man behind it, he will carve you up BUT pressure is the key because you can't just play zone and let him sit comfortably in the pocket. He will carve you up a different way.

If I were a DC, and this is where you have to have the horses to do it, my first option would obviously be to get pressure with my front 4 and mix coverage behind it. That being easier said than done, I would be stacking the box and sending LB's all day long to force Haskins to get rid of it quick (as well as disrupt the run) but playing a lot of varied zone looks behind it.

Who in CFB has the coaching and the players to do that really? Bama? Maybe Clemson? I don't see anyone in the B1G that can do it (unless we get the weather game that takes away passing for them).
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Dusting this off only because when I read the film breakdown on 11W it just cemented in my mind how good Day and company are.

All this predicted pressure came to be and caused some major problems for almost a full half. Then the OSU coaches make such a simple and elegant adjustment; you want to sell out with blitzes? We'll just throw screens.

We talked all week about how a defense can take away any two of three things but they can never take away all three. If the Penn State model is to be followed then teams will continue to sell out to stop the run and pressure Haskins while playing that deep, 1 high safety look to take away the deep threat.

Honestly, I don't know what else they can do. It's the pressure a highly competent and balanced offense can put on you as a defensive coach. Haskins has shown that he will kill you if you dare him to throw deep. The running game will kill you if you over play the pass. All you can do is force him into the short passing game and hope over the long field they have miscues that get them off track. Even more preferably you play with the lead so they have to abandon the run and you can cheat against both short and long passes.

Bottom line is, the OSU offense is so talented and well coached that it forces you, even as a top 10ish team like PSU, to cheat and now with Day, as soon as you cheat they can make you pay for it.

Good times folks. Good times.
 
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Jaxbuck said:
Dusting this off only because when I read the film breakdown on 11W it just cemented in my mind how good Day and company are.

All this predicted pressure came to be and caused some major problems for almost a full half. Then the OSU coaches make such a simple and elegant adjustment; you want to sell out with blitzes? We'll just throw screens.

We talked all week about how a defense can take away any two of three things but they can never take away all three. If the Penn State model is to be followed then teams will continue to sell out to stop the run and pressure Haskins while playing that deep, 1 high safety look to take away the deep threat.

Honestly, I don't know what else they can do. It's the pressure a highly competent and balanced offense can put on you as a defensive coach. Haskins has shown that he will kill you if you dare him to throw deep. The running game will kill you if you over play the pass. All you can do is force him into the short passing game and hope over the long field they have miscues that get them off track. Even more preferably you play with the lead so they have to abandon the run and you can cheat against both short and long passes.

Bottom line is, the OSU offense is so talented and well coached that it forces you, even as a top 10ish team like PSU, to cheat and now with Day, as soon as you cheat they can make you pay for it.

Good times folks. Good times.
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Absolutely... I just want to see them do something though to get our run game going. If we want to win it all IMO we will need to find a way to be balanced.
 
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Interesting thing I heard today... It will benefit us greatly that we've put on film that we are a very good screen team.

Everyone's answer to Haskins according to the 1st half was to bring everyone. Well now we have shown if you do that we will kill you with quick screens.

This offense can do it all and now we just have to figure out the running game. So far in big games our WRs arent catching the ball early which leads to close games. WRs need to catch the ball early and we need to scheme up some running game adjustments. We do those 2 things and this offense has it all.
 
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I loved the screen plays. For some reason historically we seldom run screens. PSU had no answers. A new wrinkle in the Offense is a good thing and is only going to make the Offense better. Dobbins is a great guy to use because he is so small and hard to locate.
 
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uhhh, isn't the screen what other teams have been running, given the DL's tremendous push? Would have thought that maybe that would have been the first thought in the OCs head. Maybe that tape was given to the D.....think we can all remember in the very short past when a fix would NOT have come, and all the O would do is bang away with the same plays and outcomes. It is refreshing to see from Ohio State. Can anyone help me with the 'eyes in the sky' cannot a fix be developed earlier than waiting for halftime? I'm pretty sure that tOSU practices screen passes on a regular basis, so all the players are familiar....go bucks!
 
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Finally getting around to watching the rest of the game and at the 8 min mark, after fantastic halftime adjustments, it looked like OSU was going to go up 21-13 and start to impose their will on PSU.

Enter the wildcat. Please just shitcan that thing. I get that they're looking to add a mobile wrinkle to the backfield, but as soon as they try it, the offenses sputtered to a halt. Either sub in Tate briefly for a few snaps, or get rid of it.

Cannot imagine that thing is ever going to be worth the practice time dedicated to it.

Now to get through the 2nd act of the crapfest until the comeback.
 
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calibuck said:
uhhh, isn't the screen what other teams have been running, given the DL's tremendous push? Would have thought that maybe that would have been the first thought in the OCs head. Maybe that tape was given to the D.....think we can all remember in the very short past when a fix would NOT have come, and all the O would do is bang away with the same plays and outcomes. It is refreshing to see from Ohio State. Can anyone help me with the 'eyes in the sky' cannot a fix be developed earlier than waiting for halftime? I'm pretty sure that tOSU practices screen passes on a regular basis, so all the players are familiar....go bucks!
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It wasn't half time, it was at the end of the first half when they made the adjustment.

Up to that point the game planned play calls were working ok but they weren't making PSU pay because of drops so it's hard to tell how good it could have been.
 
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1926Buckeyes said:
Finally getting around to watching the rest of the game and at the 8 min mark, after fantastic halftime adjustments, it looked like OSU was going to go up 21-13 and start to impose their will on PSU.

Enter the wildcat. Please just shitcan that thing. I get that they're looking to add a mobile wrinkle to the backfield, but as soon as they try it, the offenses sputtered to a halt. Either sub in Tate briefly for a few snaps, or get rid of it.

Cannot imagine that thing is ever going to be worth the practice time dedicated to it.

Now to get through the 2nd act of the crapfest until the comeback.
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Agree. OSU had Penn State on the ropes and was on the verge of breaking the game open...and then came the wildcat for -3 yards. Prior to that play, the drive consisted of plays of the following yardage gains: 13, 12, 4, 0 (incomplete pass), and 11. They were going right down the field, and that play (followed by the illegal formation penalty) brought the drive to a grinding halt.

Going up 21-13 would've taken that mongoloid crowd right out of the game, yet we sent them into a frenzy by poor play-calling and penalties, which resulted in a missed FG.
 
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TONY ALFORD SAYS J.K. DOBBINS AND MIKE WEBER BRING OUT THE BEST IN ONE ANOTHER IN OHIO STATE'S BACKFIELD

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If you ask Ohio State running backs coach Tony Alford about the biggest benefit of having two elite running backs in a backfield, he’ll be quick to answer.

“They push one another,” Alford said Tuesday after the Buckeyes’ afternoon practice. “So there’s a standard of how you go to work everyday. Do they compete? Yeah. It’s a very competitive environment. But they push one another and champion each other’s efforts.”

Alford, of course, is talking about the Buckeyes’ two-headed monster at the position, made up of redshirt junior Mike Weber and sophomore J.K. Dobbins.

Alford, who’s in his fourth year at Ohio State, says the duo has “elevated” the running backs room. It’s a statement that certainly makes sense, considering the two have combined for 730 rushing yards and six touchdowns on 134 carries, an average of 5.5 yards per attempt.

But having said that, neither are in the nation’s top 40 in rushing yards. Dobbins leads the team with 380 yards on 73 carries while Weber has amassed 350 yards on 61 attempts.

They’ve split carries and alternated offensive series throughout the first five games when both could carry a heavier load.

“When you say an entire load, we’re talking, what are we averaging, 85 plays give or take? No, a guy can’t play that many reps,” Alford said. “So you need other guys. Could they handle more than 40 reps? Absolutely. They’re trained to do that. But at the same time, we’ve got two really dynamic players. So why not get them both out there and let them play?”

In Saturday’s 27-26 win over Penn State, both indeed got their chances against the Nittany Lions’ defense. Trailing 13-0 in the second quarter, Dobbins got the Buckeyes on the scoreboard by taking a screen pass 26 yards to the end zone.

“[Dobbins] can catch but that just hasn’t been a big staple in our offense,” Alford said. “It was a great play call.”

Entire article: https://www.elevenwarriors.com/ohio...ins-push-one-another-and-champion-each-others
 
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1926Buckeyes said:
Finally getting around to watching the rest of the game and at the 8 min mark, after fantastic halftime adjustments, it looked like OSU was going to go up 21-13 and start to impose their will on PSU.

Enter the wildcat. Please just shitcan that thing. I get that they're looking to add a mobile wrinkle to the backfield, but as soon as they try it, the offenses sputtered to a halt. Either sub in Tate briefly for a few snaps, or get rid of it.

Cannot imagine that thing is ever going to be worth the practice time dedicated to it.

Now to get through the 2nd act of the crapfest until the comeback.
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Exactly... put Tate in if you want to run wild cat. He's shiftier than any of our WRs anyways and oh btw you have to respect his throwing ability.

Just dumb and yes I agree we could have taken that game over right there had we scored 7 to go up 21-13.
 
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