BCS predictions/discussion/Knock Em' Off

[Mike80]

What are the chances of Ohio State winning an AP National Title?

In the scenario you listed, non-existant.

The MNC game would have to be super sloppy (like a 10-2 game or something) where the winner wasn't clearly better than what the Rose Bowl had playing on the field for that too happen. Even then I don't think the chances are good.

 

[daveeb]

In the scenario you listed, non-existant.

The MNC game would have to be super sloppy (like a 10-2 game or something) where the winner wasn't clearly better than what the Rose Bowl had playing on the field for that too happen. Even then I don't think the chances are good.

I messed up the scenario, actually. In that situation, it would be:

1. Winner
2. Ohio State
3. Loser

It would take a messy game for that situation to work out.

 

[Buckeyedynasty]

WOW let the Buckeye bashing begin. Anyone watching any of the late coverage tonight with Scott Van Pelt talking with Herbstreit or Mark May saying we're not deserving because we don't play a conference championship game. What will they be saying if we actually get to Nat'l Championship game?

I could care less what they say. I say FUCK 'EM!

 

[billmac91]

Great we get to start this shit all week....

Didn't mean to get anyone offended. Why would he want his alma mater in the Rose Bowl over a national title game though? He said it, not me.

Why does he go on ESPN and claim Penn St. is the most talented team in the Big 10 and will win it, but go on 1460 the fan in Columbus, and in a discussion with Bruce Hooley say he thinks OSU is just as talented as any other team in the Big 10.

Why doesn't he argue that OSU should get a crack at the title game even if WVU and Missouri win their next games. It isn't a difficult argument to make. Ohio St. lost to a better team than WVU (Illinois is ranked higher than USF) and has beaten the better team. Plus OSU has much more talent on both sides of the ball. It really isn't even debateable when compared to Missouri or WVU. OSU will likely have the first Linebacker, DB, and possibly DE taken in the draft.

Herby could talk about all of this but doesn't. Instead when he had the opportunity to bash the Buckeyes (if I'm an offensive high school football player, I wouldn't go to Ohio State) he took it, but won't back us when we need it.

 

[OregonBuckeye]

Didn't mean to get anyone offended. Why would he want his alma mater in the Rose Bowl over a national title game though? He said it, not me.

Why does he go on ESPN and claim Penn St. is the most talented team in the Big 10 and will win it, but go on 1460 the fan in Columbus, and in a discussion with Bruce Hooley say he thinks OSU is just as talented as any other team in the Big 10.

Why doesn't he argue that OSU should get a crack at the title game even if WVU and Missouri win their next games. It isn't a difficult argument to make. Ohio St. lost to a better team than WVU (Illinois is ranked higher than USF) and has beaten the better team. Plus OSU has much more talent on both sides of the ball. It really isn't even debateable when compared to Missouri or WVU. OSU will likely have the first Linebacker, DB, and possibly DE taken in the draft.

Herby could talk about all of this but doesn't. Instead when he had the opportunity to bash the Buckeyes (if I'm an offensive high school football player, I wouldn't go to Ohio State) he took it, but won't back us when we need it.

Took the words right out of my mouth save for maybe the last sentence. He loves Ohio St. but I have yet to see him put his neck on the line in the national press for them.

 

[Mike80]

Didn't mean to get anyone offended. Why would he want his alma mater in the Rose Bowl over a national title game though? He said it, not me.

Why does he go on ESPN and claim Penn St. is the most talented team in the Big 10 and will win it, but go on 1460 the fan in Columbus, and in a discussion with Bruce Hooley say he thinks OSU is just as talented as any other team in the Big 10.

Why doesn't he argue that OSU should get a crack at the title game even if WVU and Missouri win their next games. It isn't a difficult argument to make. Ohio St. lost to a better team than WVU (Illinois is ranked higher than USF) and has beaten the better team. Plus OSU has much more talent on both sides of the ball. It really isn't even debateable when compared to Missouri or WVU. OSU will likely have the first Linebacker, DB, and possibly DE taken in the draft.

Herby could talk about all of this but doesn't. Instead when he had the opportunity to bash the Buckeyes (if I'm an offensive high school football player, I wouldn't go to Ohio State) he took it, but won't back us when we need it.

I'd rather have him be even-handed than having a homer on the national scene making a joke of himself.

Just say it - you think Herbie hates the Buckeyes.

Wait doesn't BN and BP both have this thread every year?

 

[Mike80]

Took the words right out of my mouth save for maybe the last sentence. He loves Ohio St. but I have yet to see him put his neck on the line in the national press for them.

I seem to remember him picking OHio State is a rather signifcant game in January of 2003 when no one else picked them....

I also seem to remember him sticking by Ohio State when the braintrust that is E$PN was trashing the school for everything as well....

Just because he doesn't think OHio State is the best team in the nation doesn't mean he's a "hater" or "doesn't stick his neck out for the team"....come on now.....

 

[(o) IoI /o\ (o)]

I'd rather have him be even-handed than having a homer on the national scene making a joke of himself.

Just say it - you think Herbie hates the Buckeyes.

Wait doesn't BN and BP both have this thread every year?

I'm going to take your side with this one. I'd rather have a "level-headed analyst" then a blatant homer for tOSU. We have enough idiots on ESPN making themselves look like idiots, we don't need another one, esp. an alumnus, making himself out to be a fool.

By the way, does anyone remember who Herbie picked to win the NC in '02...I do, he picked the Bucks to win with an "athletic defense" when Miami was heavily favored. I believe that could be considered putting his neck out for us...

 

[billmac91]

I'd rather have him be even-handed than having a homer on the national scene making a joke of himself.

Just say it - you think Herbie hates the Buckeyes.

Wait doesn't BN and BP both have this thread every year?

No I don't think he hates the Buckeyes. I don't think he's a die-hard alumnus like an Eddie George though.

Eddie George would NEVER-EVER state he wished OSU was in the Rose Bowl over the National Title game. Eddie George also does a great job on Fox's BCS show.

I think Herbstreit is proud of his university and roots for us, but I also think his relationship with the university changed when Tressel began his regime. Herby would never have stated "If i'm an offensive recruit, I'd never go to OSU" if Cooper were the coach.

I also think Herby would push the Buckeyes considerably harder, especially with as much ammo as he has (it's not like he'd be making subjective arguments), if Cooper were still the coach.

Again, facts are facts. We have more talent than WVU and Missouri. We have a better loss than WVU. We beat a better opponent than WVU. And he stated on national TV he hopes the Buckeyes end up in Pasadena.

According to Herby we only deserve a shot at the National Title if Missouri and WVU lose.

 

[Mike80]

No I don't think he hates the Buckeyes. I don't think he's a die-hard alumnas like an Eddie George though.

Eddie George would NEVER-EVER state he wished OSU was in the Rose Bowl over the National Title game.

I think Herbstreait is proud of his university and roots for us, but I also think his relationship with the university changed when Tressel began his regime. Herby would never have stated "If i'm an offensive recruit, I'd never go to OSU" if Cooper were the coach.

I also think Herby would push the Buckeyes considerably harder, especially with as much ammo as he has (it's not like he'd be making subjective arguments here), if Cooper were still the coach.

Again facts are facts. We have more talent than WVU and Missouri. We have a btter loss than WVU. We beat a better opponent than WVU.

According to Herby we only deserve a shot if Missouri and WVU lose.

What's this "we" shit? :p

And WVU and Mizzou both lost before Ohio State did and therefore are ranked ahead of Ohio State. That's another fact you've left out and it's certainly applicable here.

That's the problem with your argument and the system as a whole, you are attempting to argue a SUBJECTIVE topic (rankings/bowl berths) with other subjective and (although not to me or you) debatable material (more talented/better loss/better opponents/etc).

Herbie is paid to be both even handed and insightful as a college analyst. He seems to honestly believe what he says and unlike the other individuals E$PN employs, he sticks to what he says even if Buckeye fans disagree with it.

I'll take that. I might not agree with everything he says, but thems the breaks.

 

[OregonBuckeye]

I seem to remember him picking OHio State is a rather signifcant game in January of 2003 when no one else picked them....

I also seem to remember him sticking by Ohio State when the braintrust that is E was trashing the school for everything as well....

Just because he doesn't think OHio State is the best team in the nation doesn't mean he's a "hater" or "doesn't stick his neck out for the team"....come on now.....

Picking Ohio St. to win a game, especially considering they were ranked #2 in the nation, isn't exactly what I call putting your neck on the line. FYI, I didn't say not picking Ohio St. to win a game or not campaigning for them to go to the NC game means he's a traitor or whatever it is you seem to think I meant. I just don't like how inconsistent he is with what he says/believes and he is rarely one to stray from the pack and say something people might not like or agree with in regards to tOSU. If you don't believe Herbie has an ESPN persona then we'll just have to agree to disagree.

That's just my two cents. It's not like I accused him of being a child abuser and I certainly don't hate him. I just don't always agree with the way he handles himself.

 

[jwinslow]

Do I think Herbie loves OSU? Yes.
Do I think Herbie tries to be unbiased? Yes.
Do I think Herbie often says what ESPN wants him to? Yes. Danielson mentioned this puppeteer-ing upon his departure.

I don't hear Herbie on 1460 saying that OSU is stumbling up the polls (thanks to others losing). I heard random shots at OSU, the b10 and a gamut of weaknesses during nearly every primetime game in september that he called. Note, the 'stumbling' line was rather mild compared to some of the others, but I cannot recall those.

As for Herbie, I don't expect him to a "Buckeye through and through." He's a professional analyst and should act like one--not a shameless shill like Lou Holtz. That being said, he does seem to be bending over backwards to slam the B10 out of embarrassment for pimping them too strongly last year.

This is exactly how I feel (bumping from old thread). Before OSU was on primetime TV & their NC chances skyrocketed (and thus the motivation for ESPN pimpage), this viewpoint was purported regularly.

 

[(o) IoI /o\ (o)]

Picking Ohio St. to win a game, especially considering they were ranked #2 in the nation, isn't exactly what I call putting your neck on the line. FYI, I didn't say not picking Ohio St. to win a game or not campaigning for them to go to the NC game means he's a traitor or whatever it is you seem to think I meant. I just don't like how inconsistent he is with what he says/believes and he is rarely one to stray from the pack and say something people might not like or agree with in regards to tOSU. If you don't believe Herbie has an ESPN persona then we'll just have to agree to disagree.

That's just my two cents. It's not like I accused him of being a child abuser and I certainly don't hate him. I just don't always agree with the way he handles himself.

I dont always agree with the way he handles himself either. I think he believes that he must follow the pack, per se, then stray from it because #1 he works for ESPN and because #2 that's what everyone else is saying. I don't really know if this makes sense, but I think he thinks more "ESPN" because he is getting paid by ESPN and not tOSU. Just my take on the situation.

 

[daveeb]

Mark May, Lou Holtz, and Lee Corso are shticks. Think Dick Vitale. Used for entertainment.

Colin Cowherd takes Gary Danielson, Kirk Herbstreit, and Bob Davie (Who actually knows football. Just a terrible head ball coach. Was a good coordinator) over Mark May, Lee Corso, and Lou Holtz for a reason.

Kirk Herbstreit is on College Gameday, the premier college football game of the day, and is busy during the week on numerous radio shows.

 

[billmac91]

What's this "we" shit? :p

And WVU and Mizzou both lost before Ohio State did and therefore are ranked ahead of Ohio State. That's another fact you've left out and it's certainly applicable here.

That's the problem with your argument and the system as a whole, you are attempting to argue a SUBJECTIVE topic (rankings/bowl berths) with other subjective and (although not to me or you) debatable material (more talented/better loss/better opponents/etc).

Herbie is paid to be both even handed and insightful as a college analyst. He seems to honestly believe what he says and unlike the other individuals E employs, he sticks to what he says even if Buckeye fans disagree with it.

I'll take that. I might not agree with everything he says, but thems the breaks.

But I disagree in a lot of regards to "what he honestly believes". He panders to a national audience as an OSU alum (I'm so objective, I don't put OSU on a platform), and gets on Bruce Hooley's radio show and panders to OSU fans (best talent, great shot at title, etc.) Which one is it? Does OSU have the "elite" talent in the Big 10 and will win it, or does PSU?

And as stated before, and numerous times, why is he pulling for OSU NOT to be in the national title game? Do you know any OSU die-hards hoping OSU isn't the national champion?

He doesn't need to be subjective when arguing for the Buckeyes. In fact, he doesn't even need to make an argument for the Buckeyes. He could however (since as a Buckeye fan, I'm sure he's looked at all the data) point out the fact that we lost to Illinois, WVU lost to USF. OSU also has the "better" win. Don't say OSU should go in front of WVU, but as an OSU alum I'd expect him to raise the point.

Instead we're lurkers who can backdoor our way in if WVU or Missouri loses. If we do play WVU we're in trouble b/c we'll have a difficult time with all of that team speed WVU has.

Just to point out as well, Corso has stated he thinks OSU is the best 1 loss team. On Gameday he made that statemnet and Kirk wanted no part of it. Even when given an opportuntiy to say complimentary things of the Buckeyes he passed up the chance.

I guess, I just don't get it.