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Univ. of Illinois being sued over Chief Illiniwek

Just a sidenote to the original topic: When my wife started school at Miami (OH), they were the Redskins. Shortly after she started, a member of the community (A very caucasian member) went to the board suggesting that the name COULD offend someone of native American background. (Mind you, no one was actualy offended; just a stupid, rich white lady with nothing better to do with her time than try to stand up for a group of people perfectly capable of standing up for themselves. So was born the Miami Red Hawks.
 
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Thump said:
Ok Mr. Linguist, "Native American" name. :roll1:

Apu: Today, I am no longer an Indian living in America. I am an
Indian-American.
Lisa: You know, in a way, all Americans are immigrants. Except, of
course Native Americans.
Homer: Yeah, Native Americans like us.
Lisa: No, I mean American Indians.
Apu: Like me.
 
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Funny thing is, the Chief Whateverhisnameis is considered a distinct honor at the U of Illinois. It's almost the equivalent of getting to dot the "I" for tOSU. Not just any jackass can sign up for the job. It's extremely difficult to be picked for the position.

It's just more opportunity for someone to bitch and moan.
 
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AJHawkfan said:
Just a sidenote to the original topic: When my wife started school at Miami (OH), they were the Redskins. Shortly after she started, a member of the community (A very caucasian member) went to the board suggesting that the name COULD offend someone of native American background. (Mind you, no one was actualy offended; just a stupid, rich white lady with nothing better to do with her time than try to stand up for a group of people perfectly capable of standing up for themselves. So was born the Miami Red Hawks.

This reminds me of what is going on right now with the ANWAR debate. A number of Native American groups are against drilling, yet the actual tribe that lives on the land favors it because of the jobs it will bring to their community.

Or the even more ludicrous scenario of Wisconsin dropping Utah from its football schedule a few years back because of their "Indian" name. Nevermind that the Utes have granted permission and are proud to have the university use their name.
 
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Some native american terms do pose problems.

For instance, the "Redskins." If it is true that the term came from the name given to scalps collected from native americans in return for bounty, bloody scalps, then having a team named the "Redskins" is as offensive as have a team named the "Lampshades" in Germany (where, or so I've heard, the skin from some concentration camp Jews was made into lampshades). Also, read the case against the Washington Redskins on this subject. All the history showed that the name was used in pure ridicule until recently.

Some names, like the Utes, which celebrates a regional tribe, or the Braves, which celebrates a warrior (like Vikings) seem fine to me. Then it all goes to the characterization and representation. That seems to be the issue with the chief. I don't think this Illini deal is a big one. The Redskins name is. . .

Furthermore, even going back to the 1600s dictionaries list "redskin" as an offensive and taboo term.
 
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<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">Originally Posted by buckeyegrad
This brings up a question I have always wondered:

Why are the "Celtics" pronounced as Seltics instead of Keltics as they should be?

</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>



Probably from being drunk and slurring the words.
 
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Controversial mascot staying in Illinois during NCAA Final Four

BY ELIZABETHE HOLLAND

St. Louis Post-Dispatch

ST. LOUIS, Mo. - (KRT) - Michigan State's "Sparty the Spartan" and the University of Louisville's "Cardinal Bird the Cardinal" will be here for the NCAA Final Four his weekend in all their costume finery. So will "Rameses the Ram," mascot of the University of North Carolina Tar Heels.

But the team symbol with the shortest drive to St. Louis won't make the trip. "Chief Illiniwek" will stay home at the University of Illinois.

The chief - a student in buckskins, feathery headdress and makeup - has become less visible at athletic events over the past five years or so. Except for the occasional road game, like the Braggin' Rights showdown here between Missouri and Illinois, he seldom leaves Urbana-Champaign. There, his appearances are mainly at football, volleyball and men's and women's basketball games, said Kent Brown, the university sports information director.

Often, where there's the chief, there's trouble. Sometimes it's one person in the stands, bellowing charges that the character demeans Native Americans. Sometimes it's an organized demonstration, with harsh signs and angry words.

Detractors have achieved attention, but not the ultimate goal of packing up the costume for good. The chief remains Illinois' official symbol - the university prefers he not be called a mascot - but one that causes discomfort for the athletic program and university as a whole.

Brown said it would not be fair to say the chief's role has been reduced just to quell the controversy. "But it takes that out of play," he added.

Chief Illiniwek does not parade along the sidelines, hang out with the band or pick a pseudo fight with another team's mascot. He is a performer who presents an Indian dance, four to six minutes long, that draws rapt fans to their feet.

Even if the chief came to the Final Four, as he did the last time Illinois made it, the NCAA's carefully planned halftime show probably would not make an opening for his routine, said Tom Hardy, spokesman for the university.

Many high schools and smaller colleges have shed nicknames and symbols based on Native Americans, but fans of Chief Illiniwek insist he is not comparable. They argue that he is a respectful, proud character, who emphasizes the state's heritage and educates people about Native Americans.

"The chief embodies all the qualities that we try to strive for," said Nick Klitzing, president of Students for Chief Illiniwek and a student member of the university's Board of Trustees. "It embodies courage, strength and unity and tradition. He is the token of the University of Illinois and has been for 78 years."

Critics complain that an Indian mascot, particularly at a largely Caucasian campus, is racist and insensitive, and that 78 years of it is about 78 years too many.

"All aspects of the chief and its dance should be eliminated," said Jen Tayabji, a former Illinois student who is a member of the Progressive Resource/Action Cooperative, a group involved in trying to do away with the chief and the "Fighting Illini" moniker.

A symbol should be unifying, not divisive, Tayabji said. If it dissuades Native American students and professors from coming to Illinois, it isn't worth it, she said.

Most importantly, Tayabji said, the fact that many Native Americans find it offensive "is good enough reason to get rid of it."

Kyle Cline, the current Chief Illiniwek, could not be reached for comment.

The Board of Trustees has grappled with the controversy for years. In 1990, it endorsed the chief. But that support may be waning.

In the fall, the board unanimously adopted a resolution that whatever "consensus conclusion" it reached would include recognition of American Indian culture and traditions, Hardy said.

There are plenty of opinions from which to draw. There are whole organizations pro and con. The latter includes a Web site - www.retirethechief.org - started by Brian Jewett, a professor.

About a year ago, nearly 70 percent of Illinois students who voted in a referendum backed the chief.

Meanwhile, a report last fall by the North Central Association, a school accreditation organization, said the university will face damage if the issue isn't resolved.

And earlier this month, opponents of the chief, including the Illinois Native American Bar Association, sued to get the trustees to end the chief's reign. They said he perpetuates a racial stereotype, violates Indians' rights and violates the board's own anti-discrimination policies.

The university has publicly insisted that it isn't violating any laws or policies.

Illinois was one of 31 schools asked by the NCAA in November to explain why they feel it necessary to use American Indian imagery, said Gail Dent, an NCAA spokeswoman. Illinois' self-evaluation is due May 1.

While the chief himself will be absent from the Final Four, there are sure to be plenty of his likenesses on Illinois fans' T-shirts and other gear, and perhaps the occasional fan made up in the chief's image.

Charlene Teters, an Illinois alumna and a member of the Spokane Nation Indian tribe, said she decided about the last time Illinois made the Final Four that it was time for the chief to go. Teters, of Santa Fe, N.M., said she was upset to see her teenage children react to his performance with embarrassment and humiliation.

She eventually helped found the National Coalition on Racism and the Media, and became a familiar figure in the University of Illinois debate.

"This is not just me. It is a movement," Teters said. "But the quality of the debate really hasn't changed much."

---

© 2005, St. Louis Post-Dispatch.

Visit the Post-Dispatch on the World Wide Web at http://www.stltoday.com

Distributed by Knight Ridder/Tribune Information Services.
 
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buckeyegrad said:
This brings up a question I have always wondered:

Why are the "Celtics" pronounced as Seltics instead of Keltics as they should be?
because nobody gives a fuck how you say a word.....and nobody likes people who try to sound smart by pronouncing foreign words the way their native people say it.

how do you order a burrito?






oh yeah....and :p
 
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1) I agree that the American Indian has not been given certain liberties that we have given other groups. As someone above mentioned, no one would ever accept "Kansas City Blacks" or "New York Jews". I see no reason that Indians should be singled out.

2) With the above in mind, people who have time to worry about things like this are not working hard enough.
 
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