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2017 tOSU Offense Discussion

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jwinslow said:
With zero improvement from JT and a proper scheme, I think they beat OU as is, or get pretty close. No improvement or replacements at WR. No improvement as a passer. That's why there's a lot of room to go backwards, and as a staff I think they know they're not far off from succeeding with the existing personnel.

I agree that the recent regression is troubling.

I also don't think this team can compete with Alabama as it stands now, and I'm concerned whether Urban can get out of the offense's way in time to rescue JT. I think that's some of where the backup infatuation comes from. A guy like Haskins might be able to be the flamethrower they need to elevate the passing game and make Alabama or Clemson pay downfield when they take away the running game. I think someone like Dwayne represents the extremes of what the offense could be.
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Let's get to January before we talk about Alabama ., some are so consumed with the NC they don't enjoy the journey..some opined the season was over Saturday night.Jeez.
 
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lvbuckeye said:
It's not that it's unusual. It's that he's casually throwing the ball 30-40 yards with different touches on the throws.
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Fair enough, but without seeing comparable video from JT, Joe and/or Tate, I'm not real sure there is much to take from it.

I don't mean what follows to be intended as towards you, LV -

Losses bring out the worst in our fan base. I'm glad there are cooler heads in the WHC than what I've been reading around the interwebs these last few days. The idea that the back up QB is the savior all of a sudden... that all of a sudden the coaching staff can't recruit or otherwise is letting someone slip away owing to the staff's "thin skin" related to a tweet.... That all of a sudden Urban Meyer is a stubborn old cus who's a detriment to the program due to that stubbornness...

It's really pretty absurd. Can't wait for the Army game if for no other reason we can move on to complaining that 650 yards total offense wasn't enough.
 
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Buckeyeskickbuttocks said:
Fair enough, but without seeing comparable video from JT, Joe and/or Tate, I'm not real sure there is much to take from it.
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Yep. It's one thing to be casually slinging the rock 40 yards downfield without pads to a stationary target after a practice, and it's another to be trying to hit a moving target at that distance wearing full pads and helmet with 280lb hostile linemen chasing you in front 109,000 live and millions more on TV.
 
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Buckeyeskickbuttocks said:
Fair enough, but without seeing comparable video from JT, Joe and/or Tate, I'm not real sure there is much to take from it.

I don't mean what follows to be intended as towards you, LV -

Losses bring out the worst in our fan base. I'm glad there are cooler heads in the WHC than what I've been reading around the interwebs these last few days. The idea that the back up QB is the savior all of a sudden... that all of a sudden the coaching staff can't recruit or otherwise is letting someone slip away owing to the staff's "thin skin" related to a tweet.... That all of a sudden Urban Meyer is a stubborn old cus who's a detriment to the program due to that stubbornness...

It's really pretty absurd. Can't wait for the Army game if for no other reason we can move on to complaining that 650 yards total offense wasn't enough.
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I have been saying it for over a year. We have seen Burrow play in mop up duty. Although not the same as going against OU, the ball comes out faster. I said it last year after Rutgers where Joe played a lot. It isn't new, or just because we lost. This offense is stagnant because we cannot complete passes. We cannot stretch the field, and that is not because we don't have the speed to stretch it but because we don't have the arm strength.

I said it then and I stand by it, the offense would be more efficient with another QB, either Burrow (my preference because he can run better) or Haskins. We don't have to have a running QB, or one that runs better than JT to have a more efficient O. I would rather have a less mobile QB that converts 3rd passes instead of a read option runner that slides down now after 5 yards but can't take the top off a secondary.
 
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Hstead said:
I have been saying it for over a year. We have seen Burrow play in mop up duty. Although not the same as going against OU, the ball comes out faster. I said it last year after Rutgers where Joe played a lot. It isn't new, or just because we lost. This offense is stagnant because we cannot complete passes. We cannot stretch the field, and that is not because we don't have the speed to stretch it but because we don't have the arm strength.

I said it then and I stand by it, the offense would be more efficient with another QB, either Burrow (my preference because he can run better) or Haskins. We don't have to have a running QB, or one that runs better than JT to have a more efficient O. I would rather have a less mobile QB that converts 3rd passes instead of a read option runner that slides down now after 5 yards but can't take the top off a secondary.
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And that's fine, you certainly have been consistent and you're not bashing any OSU player by making the observations you're making. And, I don't mean to suggest any poster here is straight up bashing any OSU player, or JT either. I just sorta laugh, though, when people start calling for Dwayne Haskins to start over JT.. I mean.. based on what? Throws against air on a vine vid? The Spring Game? I mean, the OSU coaching staff sees these guys every. single. day. As 3yards said in the OU Aftermath thread, I'm inclined to defer to them when it comes to the "Put in McMullen" philosophy that seems rather prevalent in our fan-base after a loss. That's not to say the coaches are infallible or can't make mistakes, just that I'm one who is inclined to give them the benefit of the doubt, and especially so when the guy has won the way Urban has.
 
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Buckeyeskickbuttocks said:
And that's fine, you certainly have been consistent and you're not bashing any OSU player by making the observations you're making. And, I don't mean to suggest any poster here is straight up bashing any OSU player, or JT either. I just sorta laugh, though, when people start calling for Dwayne Haskins to start over JT.. I mean.. based on what? Throws against air on a vine vid? The Spring Game? I mean, the OSU coaching staff sees these guys every. single. day. As 3yards said in the OU Aftermath thread, I'm inclined to defer to them when it comes to the "Put in McMullen" philosophy that seems rather prevalent in our fan-base after a loss. That's not to say the coaches are infallible or can't make mistakes, just that I'm one who is inclined to give them the benefit of the doubt, and especially so when the guy has won the way Urban has.
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I love me some UFM, but he isn't perfect. I just think he is loyal to a fault with JT. And understandably, by all accounts he is a great guy. I think I have seen enough of Burrow, and from the spring game Haskins threw the ball pretty dang well. I said it in the spring game thread, if I didn't know any of the QBs and watched the spring game, I would have guessed it was a duel between Burrow and Haskins to be the starter and JT was third best by quite a bit. I loved me some Tressel too but I recall wishing for a QB change as well then and eventually we got it, although it should have happened sooner.
 
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I think that, even without completely fixing the offense, we can probably win 10 or 11 with any of the top three QBs. That's never been the question with JTB. The question is whether he can beat both the skunkbears, State Penn/michigan Lite, a B1G championship, and a playoff game or two. I don't think he's good enough to do so. We certainly don't beat Bucky, Bama, and the Ducks in a row with JT and not being able to do so lets down the rest of the team.
 
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Buckeyeskickbuttocks said:
...As 3yards said in the OU Aftermath thread, I'm inclined to defer to them when it comes to the "Put in McMullen" philosophy that seems rather prevalent in our fan-base after a loss...
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I remember watching the Illinois game in 2001; the first game of Bellisari's suspension. McMullen got the start in that game, with Krenzel as second string. After a few series of futility, Krenzel came in, and the offense immediately began playing much better. I don't know why, but the entire offense performed more competently when Krenzel was under center, even though both guys were mostly just handing the ball to Jonathan Wells. When McMullen handed the ball to Wells, he got stuffed; when Krenzel handed him the ball, he picked up 4 and half yards. It was really that obvious of a difference, at least as I remember it.

McMullen definitely had a better arm than Krenzel. He threw a tight spiral with pretty good velocity and good accuracy, instead of a loose wobbler. But he still lost the starting job to Krenzel and I think there's no doubt that was the right decision. The offense had plenty of weak performances with Krenzel, especially when MoC wasn't available. And McMullen came in a few times and provided a good spark with his passing. But Krenzel was clearly the better option for starting quarterback, because there was something about him, whether it was knowledge of the offense, earned trust from his team mates, his demeanor, his toughness and ability to pick up tough yards on the ground when needed, or something else that was more important than McMullen's better arm.
 
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Hstead said:
Im not buying it.
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Great. It's still quite probable.
There are true frosh that start for Power 5s every year. There is also an ENORMOUS difference between a true frosh and a RS frosh that has spent a year and a half getting coached in college and learning the offense.
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and they're usually quite rough, even the good ones. Maybe Haskins will be a rare exception.
I am 100 percent certain if God forbid JT and Burrow both had season ending injuries, Haskins would be on the field. I don't think we all of the sudden would not be worth a damn because he isn't "game ready".
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is osu "worth a damn" now?
I think we would end with the same record regardless, maybe better. I don't think we get beat any worse with Haskins behind center than we did last week.
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based on what? Such a severe disdain for the present that you're assuming anyone else is a guaranteed equal if not an improvement ?

Deciding to throw away the season and go all in is an option. The hypothetical results of that gamble are not merely status quo or better.
 
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